My forge build.....WIP......it's going to take a while!

[jaxxas]

Well I left it that long mainly because the ceramic sheath is 12" long just like the TC and I thought external protection for it might be important too. Looking back at your pics I can see now your probe is a bit lower than your burner tube. Seems to me the middle would give me a decent 'average' temp though I can see where nearer the floor would more likely give you a 'working' temp. I'll be thinking this over.

Saw your second post while writing this one.

I'm just going to wait until my gas/air system is in place and ready. Other than my anxiety there seems to be no downside by waiting.

 

[KenH]

I agree with the idea of having the pipe long enough to protect the full length of ceramic sheath. Good move.

 

[jaxxas]

OK after putting the castable on hold I've jumped into building my forge cart.

Time to start transforming all these pieces into something that will roll.

cart steel.jpg

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1st side jigging and welding...

first side jig and weld.jpg

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2nd side jigging and welding...

second side jig and weld.jpg

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Both sides all welded up...

2 sides all welded.jpg

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Tomorrow I can hopefully get the other 2 sides welded up and maybe get the casters installed.

 

[KenH]

That's going to be one solid cart! You saw the cheap HF cart I used? It's pretty good, does have a bit of reinforcing done, and MUCH better wheels.

 

[jaxxas]

I know, I have issues! It probably looks more substantial than it is, it's only 1"x1"x16 gauge tubing.

If space was not an issue I'd probably have several HF carts around my shop. I usually try pretty hard to minimize the foot print and get as much use out of anything in my shop. This cart I dreamed up will be able to hold up to four 40 pound propane tanks (if needed) on the bottom shelf, and there will another shelf above the forge for general storage. The intermediate shelf below the forge will hold tongs and such. And it will roll about the shop, most everything in my shop must roll. I plan for the blower and gas system to hang off the left side. I only have about 400 sq ft and way too much junk er tools!

 

[KenH]

Yep, space can fill up in a hurry. 40 lb tanks? That's like 2 of the normal 20 lb bottles. When I first saw the "propane tanks on bottom", I was thinking of 20 lb tanks and was going to suggest 100 lb tanks. I had been using 20 lb tanks, but they freeze up so easy I finally made the change to 100 lb tanks last Fall when TSC put them on sale for $100 each - got two of them.

 

[jaxxas]

I looked into 100 pound tanks and basically I can't man handle them by myself anymore, empty ok, full not so much. And the HOA won't have any large outdoor propane tanks so just getting them filled by delivery truck would put me in hot water. So I found that I can chain 2 or more tanks together to act as one larger tank. So if two 40 lb tanks aren't enough I'll jump to 4, I can't imagine 160 lbs total wouldn't be enough especially if you are working good with a 100 lb tank. Yes I found the same with a 20 lb tank on my old little Matheson forge. The things I was blissfully ignorant of before forging!

 

[KenH]

You live in a HOA? You poor man - what a handicap you have. {grinning}

I don't think a truck will fill a 100 lb tank, or they won't around here. The truck doesn't carry the small connector required on a 100 lb tank. I find the 100 lb tank pretty easy to handle, I use a HF crane to put empty in pickup and take full tank out. Once on floor I roll into hand truck and move to where I need it. Rolls easy on grass or gravel.

 

[jaxxas]

You live in a HOA? You poor man - what a handicap you have. {grinning}

I don't think a truck will fill a 100 lb tank, or they won't around here. The truck doesn't carry the small connector required on a 100 lb tank. I find the 100 lb tank pretty easy to handle, I use a HF crane to put empty in pickup and take full tank out. Once on floor I roll into hand truck and move to where I need it. Rolls easy on grass or gravel.

It is a handicap at times! I could tell you such stories! And then you look at how I was raised, If I didn't have an HOA to limit me I'd probably have several junk project vehicles sitting on the property, like my Daddy. And his were never ever completed either.

I could do the hand truck and cherry picker method but then I don't have a cherry picker though lately I'm feeling the need. And then the 100 pound tank wouldn't fit under the forge!?

I'm getting old quick it seems, not near as robust as I once was. I took delivery of my treadle hammer a couple months back, maybe 550 lbs or so, 680 lbs was the shipping weight. It was shipped in a crate lying on it's back. I thought about calling for help but what the heck I've done worse. It took all I could muster to stand that thing up, several curses and many prayers later I barely got it upright. About popped my cookies. That's when I started thinking I should buy a cherry picker.

 

[KenH]

This HF crane will be one of the most helpful things around: https://www.harborfreight.com/2-ton-capacity-foldable-shop-crane-69514.html
They have a 1 ton size which I purchased which I have regretted ever since. I WISH I'd got the 2 ton. I used the 1 ton for moving and setting up my lathe and mill both. AND, it's so handy for many other things.

You got a power hammer? WOW - that's nice for Damascus and San Mai. I've only got a "baking soda" power hammer {g}

 

[jaxxas]

This HF crane will be one of the most helpful things around: https://www.harborfreight.com/2-ton-capacity-foldable-shop-crane-69514.html
They have a 1 ton size which I purchased which I have regretted ever since. I WISH I'd got the 2 ton. I used the 1 ton for moving and setting up my lathe and mill both. AND, it's so handy for many other things.

You got a power hammer? WOW - that's nice for Damascus and San Mai. I've only got a "baking soda" power hammer {g}

I'll remember that when I go to buy, 2 ton it will be!

No, I have a treadle hammer, big difference! More like leg and hammer though still better than arm and hammer!

But wow you have a lathe! I dream about having a lathe, keep trying to figure out how to fit in even a small lathe. I have a little old ENCO mill drill which is a great drill but a pretty crappy mill, but I get by. A real mill would be awesome! DRO and power feed would be icing on the cake.

 

[KenH]

You did say treadle hammer, but to my mind that was power hammer. I guess there is a difference. I spent the last 30 minutes watching youtube videos on treadle hammers. Looks like they really are neat - a 3rd arm at least. The flattening iron is one of the places I think of with a treadle/power hammer. Awkward for me getting the billet to lay solid on anvil while I hold flattening iron in one hand 'n swinging hammer with other.

My mill and lathe are just small stuff, a G602 Grizzly lathe (10/22) and a G0619 grizzly mill. I do have a nice DRO on both. LOVE the DRO

 

[jaxxas]

You did say treadle hammer, but to my mind that was power hammer. I guess there is a difference. I spent the last 30 minutes watching youtube videos on treadle hammers. Looks like they really are neat - a 3rd arm at least. The flattening iron is one of the places I think of with a treadle/power hammer. Awkward for me getting the billet to lay solid on anvil while I hold flattening iron in one hand 'n swinging hammer with other.

My mill and lathe are just small stuff, a G602 Grizzly lathe (10/22) and a G0619 grizzly mill. I do have a nice DRO on both. LOVE the DRO

Bro I'm a total nube, but I love the treadle hammer, 65 lbs is so much more efficient than a 3 lb hammer. Definitely works as a third arm/hand. I bought mine through blacksmithsupply.com, it was built by a smith named Bob Alexander. I can't say enough good things about it. I kinda really wanted to build my own but given the way I work (as you've seen) it would have taken me a year and at probably twice the cost. I assume you watched the Black Bear Forge video on treadle hammers? That's the one that decided it for me.

Yeah the G0602 is exactly the lathe I've been drooling over. Just don't have enough space. I've threatened to strip out the living room and move in a lathe but I'd have to say adios to the GF. Decisions decisions!

Having the dovetailed column on the G0619 must make for a quite rigid machine compared to my old round column. I envy you and your DRO's!

 

[jaxxas]

Good day, very productive but then I'm back in familiar territory!

Started off getting the cross pieces welded in.....

cross pieces.jpg

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Welded in the bottom shelf supports..
.

bottom shelf supports.jpg

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Welded in the caster mount plates...

caster mount plates.jpg

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No picture but I tacked (welded) the casters to the caster mount plates, you really shouldn't weld galvanized stuff unless you take the proper precautions.

And here it is in all of it's rolling glory...

it rolls.jpg

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Also no in process pictures, but I welded in the intermediate and upper shelf supports as well as the cradle mount support for the forge.

At the end of the day this is it... I put the cradle and forge in just to get some idea of how it will look...
Front view....

mostly finished front.jpg

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Side view...

mostly finished side.jpg

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Well that's my day, tomorrow I need to pick up some cementitious board and some plywood. Two layers of cementitious board on both the upper and intermediate shelf. Then a layer of sheet metal on the intermediate shelf and 1/2" plywood on both the upper shelf and the bottom shelf. I'm just doubling up on the cement board due to an abundance of caution. Don't want the forge heat affecting the propane tanks or the storage shelf above.

Still awaiting my TC parts and my forge blower.

 

[KenH]

You're making progress for sure. Just how tall is that cart? How high from floor to forge center? The narrow spacing to shelf below forge shelf, is that section to hold forging tools and to provide cooling protection for propane tanks on bottom?

 

[jaxxas]

Thanks Ken!

Top of the cart will be approx 74.5"!

forge height.jpg

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I'm 6'2".... it seems comfortable unless maybe I end up holding a piece for awhile. I still need to add a work support shelf.

Yes exactly on the cooling and tools, I really hope I'm being over cautious and have plenty of dead space there. There is also probably a good 4-5" between the tanks and the intermediate shelf. I have a android compatible temp gauge that I will use to check the temps after I get the forge fired up.

 

[jaxxas]

Didn't get a lot done today, too many errands, real life keeps getting in my way.

Stopped at Loews and bought the cement board and plywood. Love that they cut the plywood for you, makes it easier to fit in my van. Also love that they give me the 10% military discount, for what ever reason Home Depot won't!?

Cut up the cement board and got them in place, fits pretty nice. I also found out that a horseshoe rasp makes for a great tool for cleaning up the edges of the cement board.

upper shelf cement board in place....

upper cement board.jpg

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intermediate shelf cement boards in place....

lower cement board.jpg

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You can also see in the above picture some of the controls I plan to use, I hope to mount them right below the intermediate shelf and have all the controls up front except of course for the blower baffle control.

Here's a distant shot to show the propane tanks and their clearance to the intermediate shelf. I think I have plenty of clearance so the forge heat shouldn't be an issue....

overall.jpg

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In this picture I was playing a bit with the blower tube and how I will mount it. My blower won't arrive until Monday so at this point it's a crap shoot....

blower tube.jpg

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I know I need to lengthen the burner tube to at least 12" per Ed's caveat about burn back.

Tomorrow I need to build a work support shelf. Maybe work on the 2 end caps, I haven't cut those yet. Might mess with with the mounts for the controls and the muffler clamp mounts that will hold the blower tube. Also I need sort through my sheet metal and come up with the steel cover for the intermediate shelf. Probably have to tack it together as I doubt I have a single piece big enough.

 

[KenH]

Yep, I think 12" is about min for the burner tube. Ed posted in a thread he wound up extended from 12" to 18" due to burn backs. My tube is around 15" from center of 90 degree elbow to tip of burner tube inside forge.

That cart is getting to looking GOOD! You do good work Joe.

 

[jaxxas]

Yep, I think 12" is about min for the burner tube. Ed posted in a thread he wound up extended from 12" to 18" due to burn backs. My tube is around 15" from center of 90 degree elbow to tip of burner tube inside forge.

That cart is getting to looking GOOD! You do good work Joe.

Thank you Ken, I have an 18" nipple to play with, I'll make it as long as I can.

 

[jaxxas]

Somewhat productive day, didn't really get as much done as I had hoped.

First I screwed down the upper and lower plywood shelves. It just needed done.

Then I cut the end cap holes with an angle grinder, managed to set my shirt on fire....

burnt shirt.jpg

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End caps view...

end caps cut.jpg

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I cut them 6" x 6" trying to get both ends to match. We'll see how that comes out in the wash.


Here are the end caps which requires an explanation....

3 pieces.jpg

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Ok there are 3 total, All different heights. The explanation is that I screwed up when I originally cut the 'bottom' end cap from the 30 pound tank. I cut it too short. So I used an old 20 pound tank and cut a longer end cap (the tall one), Not sure what the future holds for the tall end cap as it increases the volume of the forge a bit, but it gives me something to play with. I think I will put it on the rear of the forge and see how it goes. Worse case I can always cut it down. The middle height end cap is an original off the 30 pound tank that I managed to cut correctly according to my plan. The shortest end cap is a bit of a brain fart, it was the original 30 pound end cap I cut too short. So I plan to use it to make a plug for the rear of the forge when I don't need the pass through.

It was a PITA cut on the vertical bandsaw that took about 20-25 minutes and my hands were cramping almost the whole time....

pita cut.jpg

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But it nestles nicely with the other end caps so I think it is the basis for a decent plug for the rear of the forge.....

nestled.jpg

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Then I wanted to cut the steel for the top of the intermediate shelf and it turns out I don't have enough sheet metal. I'll have to go shopping I guess. So then I built a quick mount for the muffler clamp to hold the blower tube.

Here's the front view of the mock up....

blower mock front.jpg

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And a side view....( the rubber connector is to attach it to the blower)......

blower mock side.jpg

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That 3" pipe stuff is big, very heavy and quite expensive! I'll need at least 1 other muffler clamp if not 2 to secure it.


So a question for the brain trust, I've noticed pictures of Ed's blower specifically that mounted a similar blower to the one I ordered vertically, though the link where I bought mine says it must be mounted in the horizontal position. Vertically would suit my build better though if it has to be horizontal I can work with it. Any thoughts?