Knife Collecting as an Investment

Larry B. said:
Buy low sell high refers to any investment. Gold, Real Estate, Stock Market, etc. That won't work for most because you didn't include the most important aspect of knife investing. Having the connections to get the knife for a price where you can realize a profit. Even if you can realize a profit it isn't enough for me to take it as a serious investment.
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From an investment perspective, I believe buying the right knife is more important than the price paid. If it's not a good knife you are going to have difficulty selling/profiting from it no matter how little you paid.
On the other hand if you purchase a great knife there's still a good chance to profit even if you paid too much. People will pay more for great knives. Even more than they are worth.
 
Hi Kevin,

I was delayed in answering this as I had to finish up several articles for Blade and KI.

One of these articles was on investing in custom knives.

Les, this thread is not about Loveless knives and can be a very productive thread without our back and forth.
So I suggest you start a thread someplace else if you want to continue the Loveless discussion.
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Kevin, I asked you specifically about Jerry's knives and how you would feel if they were built the same as how Loveless knives were built...not technique...but using another maker and still putting the Fisk name on it.

You should run for office, as you know how to duck a question.
 
Les Robertson said:
Hi Kevin,

I was delayed in answering this as I had to finish up several articles for Blade and KI.

One of these articles was on investing in custom knives.

Kevin, I asked you specifically about Jerry's knives and how you would feel if they were built the same as how Loveless knives were built...not technique...but using another maker and still putting the Fisk name on it.

You should run for office, as you know how to duck a question.
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No Les not ducking a question, I specifically told you that I wasn't going to continue this back and forth with you in this thread as the principles of this forum do not want drama and confrontation here. If you want to continue the "Loveless" discussion then start a thread regarding "Loveless not making knives" somewhere else. Or better yet find me at Blade Show in a couple weeks. I will split my time between the CKCA Booth in the lobby and table 16-O in the ABS section. We can find some place to discuss anything you like.
 
james terrio said:
If the collectible knife world is anything like the collectible guitar world, that situation will change... in a few years, maybe a couple decades. "Original" will count for much more in the long run. PRS guitars coming off the assembly line right now are arguably "better" than the ones Paul Reed Smith built himself back in the 70's, but they'll never appreciate to the same degree.

I was not aware that original Loveless knives are being re-handled with fancier materials... frankly, that boggles my mind and can only mean the people doing it are trying to cash in quick, in the short term. The people buying such knives today better get rid of them quick, because the inflated value won't last. On the other hand, by doing so, they're increasing the long-term value of un-retouched original Loveless pieces.

*sigh* all this is too complicated for a simple man like me. I don't mean to cast aspersions on anyone, but there is a seedy undercurrent to this stuff, when we start talking about things like "remodeling" original pieces and makers kicking buyers to the top of their production list depending on how many pieces they order and why they're buying them.
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True dat, sir!!!! If anyone here thinks that knives are a funny business, they should check out guitars!!! Paul Reed Smith is a good example. Just the fact that as a very successful guitar maker, he now probably has access to much better raw materials than when he was trying to sell guitars to Carlos Santana out of the trunk of his car supports your assertion. I would argue that the only guitars that you can say are truly better than the ones being made today (by some custom maker if not by the big guitar companies like Fender and Gibson) are the older Martins and that is because the wood they were made from is VERY difficult to obtain. But that only applies to the "standard models" like the D-18 or D-28 because you can get them to build you one out of the old Brazilian rosewood and Adirondack spruce stocks that they have squirreled away or have a custom maker use those materials. I was quite surprised to find out that the only part of a 1959 Les Paul that was made out of "unobtanium" was the fretboard which was Brazilian. The Cuban mahogany supply had already pretty much dried up by that time.
 
I dont think you will make much off knives unless you get them at like a bankrupcy sale or something like that. The reason I say that is in 2 to 5 years knives dont go up in price that fast its a very slow curve from what ive seen its pretty much the same curve for learning to make knives your talent is what your paying for knothing more . Some people have more talent than other and some reach the top of the ladder faster than others so the same goes for the price of a knife . Some makers knives will never sell for much more than they sold them for 20 years ago . Its just like baseball cards big name star sells for big bucks no name nobody sells for sqwatt and never will sell for big bucks . JMHO KellyW
 
I agree that it's difficult for one to profit from knives" in general.

But then it's difficult to profit on any "collectible" in general no matter whether it's coins, stamps, sports memorabilia, classic cars or whatever.

It's more about education and the do diligence of knowing what maker's knives to purchase, what particular piece to purchase, what to pay for it, when to buy it and when to sell it.

You don't go to the stock pages and pick a random stock and expect it to be a great performer for you, so why would you expect to purchase a random custom knife and expect it to go up in value?
 
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Kevin Jones said:
so why would you expect to purchase a random custom knife and expect it to go up in value?
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I'll answer that question.
If our economy is down, less people are buying/collecting luxury items. Except for the fella that purchases ONE custom knife for his hunting trips, custom knives are a luxury item.
As our economy improves, hopefully (especially if your a knife maker) more folks will purchase custom knives. That should bring the price up.
Perhaps those of you who have been in the custom knife collecting/buying/selling biz for some time could relate if this was true a few years ago when the US economy was better. Were more people buying custom knives? Were prices higher? Have prices come down since 2008 or so?
 
Kevin Jones said:
I agree that it's difficult for one to profit from knives" in general.

But then it's difficult to profit on any "collectible" in general no matter whether it's coins, stamps, sports memorabilia, classic cars or whatever.

It's more about education and the do diligence of knowing what maker's knives to purchase, what particular piece to purchase, what to pay for it, when to buy it and when to sell it.

You don't go to the stock pages and pick a random stock and expect it to be a great performer for you, so why would you expect to purchase a random custom knife and expect it to go up in value?
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martentrapper said:
I'll answer that question.
If our economy is down, less people are buying/collecting luxury items. Except for the fella that purchases ONE custom knife for his hunting trips, custom knives are a luxury item.
As our economy improves, hopefully (especially if your a knife maker) more folks will purchase custom knives. That should bring the price up.
Perhaps those of you who have been in the custom knife collecting/buying/selling biz for some time could relate if this was true a few years ago when the US economy was better. Were more people buying custom knives? Were prices higher? Have prices come down since 2008 or so?
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Though I agree with you in general terms regarding luxury items, it's not that simple with custom knives. Buying random custom knives without regard to future resale, the maker's position in the marker, secondary market trends etc will most ALWAYS result in a knife that will go down in value no matter the condition of the economy.

In my opinion though custom knife sales in general may been a little off, investment grade custom knives have done well in spite of the weak economy of the last couple years. Which is not surprising, as investors often shift from stocks to more tangible investments such as gold and collectibles when the stock market is volatile.
 
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martentrapper said:
Now that looks like a term that needs better description.
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Probably the simplest definition in my opinion of an "investment grade custom knife" to save writing a page is a knife which will most likely (or thought to be most likely) to appreciate in value over time for multiple reasons and is purchased for such.

As opposed to a knife which is purchased to be used or solely because it's appealing to the purchaser and is not likely to go up in value and/or expected too.

Investment grade knives are not always synonymous with expensive knives in my opinion.

Might be interesting to get other's definitions or even if others feel there is such a thing as an investment grade custom knife.
 
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Kevin Jones said:
Probably the simplest definition in my opinion of an "investment grade custom knife" to save writing a page is a knife which will most likely (or thought to be most likely) to appreciate in value over time for multiple reasons and is purchased for such.
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Thanks Kevin. But this raises more questions.
How do you identify a knife, "most likely to appreciate"?
Is it better to commission such a knife? If so, what traits would contribute to a knife's ability to appreciate?

I think Les Robertson's book on Custom Knife buying is helpful and mentions identifying knives likely to appreciate. Would like to hear others ideas.
 
Hi Marten,

Pick up a copy of the current issue of Knives Illustrated. There is an article on investing with custom knives. I suspect a majority of your questions will be answered.

There are examples of makers who have become successful and why.

No, no Loveless, Moran, other big names that everyone throws out.

The article was so Good KI (Bruce Voyles) made me their Custom Knives Field Editor. :D
 
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martentrapper said:
Recently got in to collecting. With the economy at a low, must be a good time to buy.
Interested in others thoughts and ideas in what to purchase, what to look for, etc. High end (Randalls, etc.), new makers, who's destined to be famous in the knife world?
Have some ideas on a direction, but I'm new at this. Looking at a 10 year or longer time frame.
Thinking of using knives as another source of investing for the future.
MT
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I Would love to say that i totally agree with you it's a better and profitable investment and business if it is started.
 
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