A couple of IKBS questions

10es&

Member
Recently I stumbled on the IKBS Knife Technology web site and was very impressed with this idea. I have probably read every word in the tutorial ten times now. Though I have never laid hands on a knife with IKBS I cant wait to try and make one!!!

I have a couple of questions that I hope you IKBS guys could answer...

1 In the tutorial it shows counterboring the handle and using the bearings to make a “race”.
Is there any reason that a person could not use a ball end mill and mill the race? Would this method be frowned on when submitting a knife for approval from the IKBS guys?

2 Would it be acceptable to make the bearing races in the blade rather than the liners? I ask this because I prefer to use thinner titanium liners for weight on my liner-locks.

3 It seems to me that everyone is using 1/16” bearings, would 1mm (.03937) diameter work and be acceptable for approval from the IKBS guys?


Thanks
Brett
 
Brett, you can use any means of making the race you want. I use a counterbore. You can put it in the blade or frames. But if you want to use IKBS and sell the knife having it, you must go through the approval steps mention on their website.
 
Brett,

The IKBS patent covers the fact that you put a recess into part of the knife and throw in some small balls to create a frictionless thrust bearing so the blade will rotate freely. The size of the balls does not matter. Putting your recess in the blade may or may not matter from the patent's perspective. That would be for lawyers and a court to decide. You can use a counterbore or an end mill or chuck it in a lathe and bore it, but the end result is the same, you have a recess for the loose balls in the liners or handle of the knife. In order for you to legally use this system you have to be granted a license from the original patent holders. They'll give that to you if a. your test knife passes, b. you etch the IKBS logo onto your blade, and c. they bother to get back to you with the approval.

The IKBS system does work well. However, there are several drawbacks. One is the fact that you have about 26 loose balls to deal with during the entire construction of the folder. You drop a "bearing set" and you've pretty much lost 13 of the balls. On assembly you have to deal with holding one set of balls in place while holding it upside down and putting the other set in its liner in place. You can learn it, but it's a bit of a pain. Another drawback is that the thrust bearing surface diameter is only around 1/4". On many conventional folders using thrust washers you have a diameter of 1/2" which gives more support to the blade around the pivot. On my IKBS test knife I made the counterbore larger and turned a couple of brass spacers so that the balls ran in a larger diameter circle. Here is another concern that I and some others have experienced. My test knife was returned to me 2 years ago and was discussed by myself and the man who does the examination here in the US. All sounded well, but even after emails asking about it I have never heard whether I passed or not. I know of others with the same problem. Without that approval and the artwork for your stencils you can't use the system without the possibility of a lawsuit.

You do not want to use a ball end mill for your counterbore. You can round off or chamfer the corners of a flat bottom end mill if you like (that's what I did) but the "race" you are creating needs to be flat and parallel with the sides of the liners and blade tang. If you use a ball end mill your balls will be forced to the lowest point which is right up against the pivot. You would have the balls rubbing up against both the liner and the pivot and there would be some drag, defeating the purpose of the system.

There is an alternative to the IKBS that works as well, is easier to create, and requires no certification of the patent holder. USA Knifemakers Supply and Alpha Knife Supply both sell frictionless bearing sets for thrust bearings. Tracy's and Chuck's bearings are different, but work in the same way. You counterbore the liners/handles and/or the blade, and set the bearing sets in place. These bearing sets have the bearings held by a "cage" of steel (USA) or nylon (AKS) so that when you drop a whole bearing set on the floor you simply pick it up, blow off the dust, and go back to work. Sure beats chasing down all those loose balls! They are not particularly expensive to buy. There is only a little more time involved in an extra set of counterbores, and that is offset by simply dealing with a bearing set, a single thing per side, and not a bunch of loose balls. And you don't have to get stencils and etch someone else's logo on your knife. Many of my knives are at the art and presentation level. I don't even etch my own logo onto the blade, but place it inside so as not to detract from the art I've created. I sure wouldn't want something as large as the IKBS logo out on the blade as well. This is the only way I'll be making a folder with frictionless bearings from now on. I recommend you look into it.

David
 
Guys, thanks for the great replies on IKBS.

David,
Thank you for introducing me to the other thrust bearing techniques. After reading your post it is easy for me to see some real advantages to the “caged” bearings. I am anxious to give this method a try!

Brett
 
I am not sure what ikbs is doing but TiKnives was using a loose ball system in 1999. They changed to my system in 2000. I covered using loose balls in holes in my patent, as well as thrust bearings with and without a race. I have used bearings in my knives since 1996, if anyone has questions or needs help just ask!
 
I found the IKBS site and took a look at what they are doing. I can see where this would be a good system for a balisong, clean and simple. Thats not the way TiKnives used loose balls. The cold rolling is more similar but they machined in the groove. In my opinion the IKBS is probably a good system in some applications and you dont have to be a machinest to pull it off! As for the counterbore just pick up an interchangable pilot counterbore and the pilot to match your pivot. Try enco or mcmaster carr if your supplier doesnt have them.
 
Thats the VooDoo! Thrust bearings come in several sizes in both ball and roller. I use a roller thrust bearing in the majority of my knives. I like the feel and stability better than the ball. The one I use is an INA axk 0515. That is a 5mm id and a 15mm od.
 
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If you want to use the bearing I use let me know, I'd be happy to hook you up. They are not common, I had my supplier bring them in for me. They cost about $3.75 ea. Same goes for anyone else!
 
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