Iron tired wagon wheels

K

KenH

Well-Known Member
Hello all, I hope this is the correct forum for this question, but what type of steel is the iron band around an iron tired wagon wheel? I'm talking about the wide band circling the whole wheel - is it low carbon or high carbon? Would it be similar to a car spring (I understand a CTS - Chevy Truck Spring - is a lot like 5160? Similar to the coil springs under cars.

I've got a short section of this iron band - seems pretty hard, when grinding it throws a fairly orange spark, and looks a lot like the spark thrown by a spring steel. Comparing to a piece of 1095 the sparks look about the same, but different than a coil spring when ground.

I'm very new to this and hate to ask a question that might be out of place, but I never know unless I ask.

Thank you all for any info,

Ken H>
 
Mystery steel.

If you're very lucky, sometimes you can find a very old one made with wrought iron.
Cut a piece and inspect cross section for a fibrous appearance. Etching can be a secondary test if the first test seems inconclusive.
Much like going to salvage yards for old Chevy V-8's, finding a wheel or band made out of WI (wrought iron) has nearly went the way of the dinosaur.
But you never know.....

Other than differentiating between WI and steel, the only other thing you can do is a test to determine if carbon content is enough to make a blade.
Spark tests are OK with a well-trained eye.
Another test is bringing up to temp, quenching in water, then hitting with a hammer. If you can break the hardened steel into pieces with a hammer, then it has enough carbon content to benefit from heat treatment and may have potential for a blade.
Any such testing will simply provide estimations relating to suitability for a particular purpose, and should not be viewed as a way to actually identify the steel.
 
Thanks for the info Rob - I'd never thought about the rim being made from WI. I would think WI would be fairly soft for long wear for a rim? Looks like rolling/wearing on the ground would wear WI too fast?

I'm no expert by a long shot, but the sparks sure looked similar to the bar of 1095 I've got. I just might try a small section quench in water and see what happens. It being a wheel rim, it's a full 1/4" (almost anyway) and over 2" wide - that would take a pretty hard womp to shatter even hardened steel. Maybe I could pound out a small section into a thin section making it easier to shatter?

Thanks again,

Ken H>
 
I can't answer what material yours is made from,however I ran across 7 of the old wagon tires a few years ago.
I bought all 7,not knowing if they would be WI,all but 1 was Wrought.
If it is WI you should be able to make a cut about 2/3 through,and bend it over WI will
look like fibers.

God bless,Keith
 
A quick update on the Iron tired wagon wheels - looks like is not high carbon steel. I took a small piece of the metal today and heated to a cherry red, quenched in water and a file still cut pretty good. It would also bend with a hammer. Not a knife steel it seems.

Thanks to all for the info,
Ken H>
 
If it is Wrought it should look something like this.
Hope this helps

God bless,Keith
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That helps a lot - thank you for photos. From looking at those I'm pretty it is not WI. I will double check when I get home next wk. those photos will help ID the WI

Ken h
 
OK, it took a while but I've finally got time to cut and break over the wagon tire iron I have. See photo - sorry it's not as good as the one posted by Keith, but maybe ya'll can tell there doesn't seem to be any "fiber" look to the break over.... or to me anyway. I suspect it's simple old iron. Thank ya'll again for all the help,

Ken H. (that image didn't format the way I wanted on screen either!)

 
From your photo it does look like wrought iron to me. If it were iron it would have broke when you bent it. I've been working exclusively with wrought iron for my fittings for the last 10 or 12 years. I have run into a few newer wagon wheels that are made out of iron. I like that as much as the wrought iron. It drills a lot easier. No silica in it. I've only run into one small wagon wheel that is carbon steel and it had enough carbon to harden up in oil.
 
Thank you for the input Raymond - it just didn't "look" the same as the photo posted by Keith. His example shows nice "strings" looking steel in the break bending over, while my break didn't show that "string" look as clear.... Looking at my photo now I think I should have left it larger. I was trying not to post "too" large an image, but sometimes the extra size is required for good detail to show up.

Hmmmm, looking at Keith's top image the bend doesn't seem to show the "strings" in bend as much as bottom image.... I'll look at my bend again tomorrow.

This is from a large wagon wheel, and it does not seem to harden at all - well, not to the "shattering" stage anyway. I'll play with it a bit more. If it seems like WI, I might use some for a hilt on a dagger I'm planning.

Thanks again for all help,

Ken H>
 
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Clean a piece up and etch it,I think you will see it's WI
but as Ray said wrought or not,it will make some nice fittings
Good luck

God bless,Keith
 
Keith, you mention "etching" to determine if WI - I did some searching and reading. Several mentioned use FeCl, and different acids - Nitric, HCl, vingar, etc. I'd like to use HCl since I've got plenty of that (use for etching printed circuit boards).

This thread has been VERY educational for me. Thank ya'll for the help and guidance,

Ken H>
 
Here is some WI from waggon wheels I have. WI is much harder to come by than HC steel so make double sure it is not WI. WI is very useful in guards and pretty expensive in the knife community

IMG_0242.jpg


IMG_0243.jpg


IMG_0241.jpg
 
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