First Vinegaroon sheath

Ernie Swanson

Ernie Swanson

SASSY PINK LUUNCHBOX KNIFE MAKER
Here is a pic of a new thing for me,
New design, first time using vinegaroon, and first time doing a basket weave.

For the vinegaroon, I just used about a half a gallon of white distilled vinegar and 3 things of 00 steel wool that I burned to oil off.

Took about 4 days to get black, after 24 hours it was a nice blue color.

I am going to try better ways to make more I definitely need to make about 2 gallons:eek:[

034-2.jpg
 
Looks good Ernie, did you soak the sheath for 4 days in order for it to turn black? Did you use black thread or did it turn the thread black too?
 
Cliff Fendley said:
Looks good Ernie, did you soak the sheath for 4 days in order for it to turn black? Did you use black thread or did it turn the thread black too?
Click to expand...

No, I just dunked the sheath in it for about 30 seconds then took it out, rinsed with warm water, then I rubbed it with baking soda. Then I placed it in a baking soda/water bath for about 30 seconds then rinsed again with water.
Then I did my wet forming and let dry.
After that I gave it a coat of leather balm with atom wax and a coat of neatsfoot oil.

I used black thread on this one, But I believe it wont turn any thread black.

Vinegaroon is not a dye it is a chemical, It has a chemical reaction with the tannins in the leather that cause it to turn black, That is what the baking soda is for, to neutralize.

You need to test the vinegaroon every day before use, The first day I got a nice blue, second day almost a midnight blue, 3rd day a really deep purple and then 4th day black.
 
Dan Pierson said:
Sounds like any of those days might have been useful, hmmm :)
Click to expand...

Exactly - the acetic acid in the vinegar needs to dissolve the iron/steel completely fro best results and that takes a bit of time.

FWIW here's an original recipe for vinegar balk and how I've been doing it for the last 40 years:

Vinegar black aka vinegaroon aka ferric or ferrous nitrate
The original recipe:
VINEGAR BLACK
For giving color to the grain of leather there is no blacking that will at all compare with the well known vinegar black. This may be made in various ways. The simplest, and, without doubt, the best, is to procure shavings from an iron turner (note: some folks get the turnings from brake drums) and cover them with pure cider vinegar; heat up and set aside for a week or two, then heat again and set in a cool place for two weeks; pour off the vinegar, allow it to stand for a few days, and draw off and cork up in bottles. This will keep for a long time, and, while producing a deep black on leather, will not stain the hands.

How I do it most times:
I use de-oiled 4/0 steel wool: dip in acetone, squeeze out the extra and hang to dry - then tear or cut into small pieces. Add one pads worth of the de-oiled steel wool to one quart of white or cider vinegar - I use those plastic coffee "cans" and punch a single small hole in the lid to let off any gas buildup. Let it set in the hot sun which will speed the reaction. I let it set for about two weeks until there is only a light vinegar odor left and/or the bulk of the steel wool has been dissolved. About every couple of days I also stir the mix around so that it gets aerated - the mix needs oxygen to work best. I also keep a new batch "cooking" all the time so I have a constant supply.
For a deeper black, apply a bath of strong black tea first (this increase the tannins) and let it soak in good, then apply a generous amount of the vinegar black. Let set for about a half hour and then rinse with a mix of baking soda and warm water, about a 1/8 cup soda to a half gallon of water, dunk it in the mix or apply liberally with a sponge en let set for a few moments ONLY (too oong and you can "burn" the leather) and then rinse off with clean cool water. While still damp apply a light coat or two of your favorite saddle oil. Once dry top coat as normal
Experiment - I test a piece of each new side without oiling to see how well it takes the blacking, if need be I'll do a second black tea mix to darken, then apply the oil which also helps darken.

Instead of steel wool you can use chopped up bailing or fence wire - the smaller the better since it will dissolve in the vinegar bath faster.

BTW - this mix also makes a great "dye" for curly maple........
 
Last edited:
ChuckBurrows said:
Exactly - the acetic acid in the vinegar needs to dissolve the iron/steel completely fro best results and that takes a bit of time.

FWIW here's an original recipe for vinegar balk and how I've been doing it for the last 40 years:

Vinegar black aka vinegaroon aka ferric or ferrous nitrate
The original recipe:
VINEGAR BLACK
For giving color to the grain of leather there is no blacking that will at all compare with the well known vinegar black. This may be made in various ways. The simplest, and, without doubt, the best, is to procure shavings from an iron turner (note: some folks get the turnings from brake drums) and cover them with pure cider vinegar; heat up and set aside for a week or two, then heat again and set in a cool place for two weeks; pour off the vinegar, allow it to stand for a few days, and draw off and cork up in bottles. This will keep for a long time, and, while producing a deep black on leather, will not stain the hands.

How I do it most times:
I use de-oiled 4/0 steel wool: dip in acetone, squeeze out the extra and hang to dry - then tear or cut into small pieces. Add one pads worth of the de-oiled steel wool to one quart of white or cider vinegar - I use those plastic coffee "cans" and punch a single small hole in the lid to let off any gas buildup. Let it set in the hot sun which will speed the reaction. I let it set for about two weeks until there is only a light vinegar odor left and/or the bulk of the steel wool has been dissolved. About every couple of days I also stir the mix around so that it gets aerated - the mix needs oxygen to work best. I also keep a new batch "cooking" all the time so I have a constant supply.
For a deeper black, apply a bath of strong black tea first (this increase the tannins) and let it soak in good, then apply a generous amount of the vinegar black. Let set for about a half hour and then rinse with a mix of baking soda and warm water, about a 1/8 cup soda to a half gallon of water, dunk it in the mix or apply liberally with a sponge en let set for a few moments ONLY (too oong and you can "burn" the leather) and then rinse off with clean cool water. While still damp apply a light coat or two of your favorite saddle oil. Once dry top coat as normal
Experiment - I test a piece of each new side without oiling to see how well it takes the blacking, if need be I'll do a second black tea mix to darken, then apply the oil which also helps darken.

Instead of steel wool you can use chopped up bailing or fence wire - the smaller the better since it will dissolve in the vinegar bath faster.

BTW - this mix also makes a great "dye" for curly maple........
Click to expand...

Looked at your WEB site you do some very nice work looks like a great resource.
 
Chuck, how do you use the vinegar black to dye the curly maple? I have quite a bit of the wood and would like to get the most out of it. Denny
 
I've heard of this mixture for maple but I didn't know it would work as a leather dye too. I never used it either way, but from pics and WIPs I've seen it sure seems to really make the grain/birdseyes/curliness pop out. The wood doesn't get as dark as the leather, just a nice deep brown with darker contrast in the figure of the grain. Apparently it's a fave among people who build old-timey muzzle-loaders and such.

IIRc they use about the same mix for maple, and brush it on/neutralize it about the same as described here for leather. I think they then oil with linseed, tung, or similar.

FWIW I once used a pasty mix of lye (Red Devil drain cleaner, it's just crystals of sodium hydroxide) and water to treat maple scales (after they were shaped, etc). Forget where I got the idea, it was on a forum somewhere. Anyway it turned the wood a sickly green and I thought I ruined it. But a quick brush-up with 0000 steel wool took most of the green away, and the grain really popped. I then dyed the wood with cheap grocery-store black leather dye, and it really worked well. Nice shimmer and "depth" and the contrast was excellent. I find this weird because lye is a base, and vinegar is an acid but it worked the same way... *shrug*
 
Me too, Denny. I already have some vinegar I bought for loosening up the mill scale on barstock, and I have pads of 0000 steel wool I got for finishing handles. can't hurt to try!
 
Well since I am responsible for sparking interest in so many, this is the way I did it.

I found a plastic container big enough to hold all the vinegar I had plus room for the steel wool.

I then washed the steel wool in gasoline then burned it all off, After the flames went out I pulled the steel wool apart and lit it on fire again.

I then poured all the vinegar in the container and added the steel wool. I set the cover on it but did not tighten it. (it will make gases and needs to breath)

I set it aside and stirred it up every 24 hours. I also took a piece of leather and soaked in it for about 30 seconds, rinsed with water, then soaked in a baking soda bath for about 30 seconds, rinsed with water again then let dry.

I did this every day until I got black.

Then I strained the solution into another container then strained again using a coffee filter.

I have read(when researching this) that the color my vary between different sides pieces of leather, I read that it is best to test on a piece from the same stuff you are making the sheath from.

Another thing I read was that you should not keep this in your shop as it can rust everything:eek:? I did mine in my shop and did not really notice any extra rusting(high humidity caused my to oil everything down).

If anyone has any help with this please feel free to ask here or pm me!!
 
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