Stabilizing Juice

Gliden07

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
Wondering if anyone has tried the BVV wood stabilizer. They say it's "SUPERIOR TO CACTUS JUICE"!! BVV sells both and the pricing is really close so that's not an issue. Also what is a good epoxy to cast with to make scales. This is gonna be a Winter project! Just want the best product for my wandering into stabilization and scale making. Any input is welcome!!
 
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I use cactus juice and I haven’t had any issues with scales I’ve done.
My setup is anything but professional, but I do follow the instructions to the best of my ability.
I have done some box elder burl, dried and finished it, then weighed it. Then I submerged it in water for 3 days. The weight change was negligible, scientifically insignificant at best.
Not saying I’m right, not saying I’m wrong. But it works for me. I’m certain there are areas in which I could improve, but sometimes good enough, is enough.
my opinion.
 
Haven’t used that product, but have used CJ. Make sure you have a decent vacuum chamber. Takes a while to do, and it’s extremely expensive to get started in, if you want to get really good results. Like a couple grand expensive. I really like “Superclear” epoxy resin, the 36 hour stuff. It’s super clear!
 
Edwardshandmadeknives said:
Haven’t used that product, but have used CJ. Make sure you have a decent vacuum chamber. Takes a while to do, and it’s extremely expensive to get started in, if you want to get really good results. Like a couple grand expensive. I really like “Superclear” epoxy resin, the 36 hour stuff. It’s super clear!
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I'm just gonna be doing this pretty much for myself. Not that I doubt what your saying but why so much??
 
Gliden07 said:
I'm just gonna be doing this pretty much for myself. Not that I doubt what your saying but why so much??
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A decent vacuum pump will run you about $600. You need a chamber that can handle both extreme vacuum and pressure for best results. I had mine custom made from schedule 80 seamless steel pipe, with a bolted #3000 flange. That was $1300. I use a nitrogen tank to pressurize it after vacuum, I don’t recall what I paid for that, but it’s $28 to fill. Assorted gauges and valves probably were another couple hundred bucks. I also bought a microscope so I could analyze thin slices of samples to see what kind of penetration I was getting. That was $400.
Now, that’s for a pretty serious setup. I don’t doubt you can get pretty decent results with a much less serious rig, but that’s what I ended up building. I just do it for my own use too, but I suspect I might get a little carried away sometimes……
 
Yep Edward, I do think you might get carried away a bit sometimes :) BUT, that does sound like a really nice setup you've got. I'll bet you can stabilize woods that don't stabilize very well with vacuum only.

Here's a suitable pump for home use with CJ for $90 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B095HJSMFM/

Here's a neat setup ready to go complete with vacuum pot, pump, gauge, etc for $163 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089JWTFHR/

When finished stabilizing clean block of wood and drop into water. If done properly it will either sink or float just barely even with water. About the same as the K&G blocks of wood I've got.

The time to pull vacuum isn't very long, not usually more than a couple of hours, maybe more. The soak time after releasing vacuum can be overnight with no problem.
 
KenH said:
Yep Edward, I do think you might get carried away a bit sometimes :) BUT, that does sound like a really nice setup you've got. I'll bet you can stabilize woods that don't stabilize very well with vacuum only.

Here's a suitable pump for home use with CJ for $90 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B095HJSMFM/

Here's a neat setup ready to go complete with vacuum pot, pump, gauge, etc for $163 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089JWTFHR/

When finished stabilizing clean block of wood and drop into water. If done properly it will either sink or float just barely even with water. About the same as the K&G blocks of wood I've got.

The time to pull vacuum isn't very long, not usually more than a couple of hours, maybe more. The soak time after releasing vacuum can be overnight with no problem.
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Yes, I’ve some “tough” wood with varying levels of success. “Dry” wood stabilizes really well, oily wood like Bocote, not so much. I’ll pull vacuum for around a day or so until the vacuum stops dropping when I shut off the pump. Then after releasing the vacuum, I’ll pump it up with nitrogen to 200 - 500 pounds, that helps force the resin through the wood. Soak time is much less with pressure too. With birch, full penetration is usually around 30 minutes.
 
an old pressure canner/cooker makes a pretty good pot. I remade the lid out of 1" poly carb so I could see what it is doing. I'm with Edward on a quality pump. A cheap one will give you a good education but long term (if the bug bites) you'll prolly want a good one.
 
Edwardshandmadeknives said:
Or a turbo molecular siphon if you really want to get weird :)
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Thank you! I have not heard that term in the 20 years I have been out of the lab. Coming across it in the middle of a knife forum, it was a strange moment of gears clicking back together that haven't been engaged in a long time. Pretty cool instant. Thanks, again! :)
 
KenH said:
Yep Edward, I do think you might get carried away a bit sometimes :) BUT, that does sound like a really nice setup you've got. I'll bet you can stabilize woods that don't stabilize very well with vacuum only.

Here's a suitable pump for home use with CJ for $90 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B095HJSMFM/

Here's a neat setup ready to go complete with vacuum pot, pump, gauge, etc for $163 shipped: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089JWTFHR/

When finished stabilizing clean block of wood and drop into water. If done properly it will either sink or float just barely even with water. About the same as the K&G blocks of wood I've got.

The time to pull vacuum isn't very long, not usually more than a couple of hours, maybe more. The soak time after releasing vacuum can be overnight with no problem.
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I noticed on the Amazon description of the second link, with the pump, pot, and everything, it says "not for wood stabilizing". I wonder if there's a good reason for their disclaimer, or if it will work fine and they are just wanting to avoid warranty claims. I have a similar pump that I've used for taking air samples as part of my home inspection business, wondering if it would work for stabilizing. Just pondering that.
 
Ooops, you're right Bill, it does say "not for wood stabilizing" and I missed that, even though it's in the headline with bold letters. Not sure why it says that, here's what looks like the identical system which says "for wood stabilizing". https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08ML91MSZ/

While I don't have those exact pumps, I have used a couple of cheap 1 stage pumps which will pull 29 in Hg just fine. I'm not sure that running 12 hr straight would be good for them, but 2 or 3 hrs is just fine.
 
52 Ford said:
If you're gonna go that far, you might as well you a turbo encabulator. Heck, even a RETRO encabulator.

Sent from my Champion Forge using Tapatalk
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Man, he had me sold at “lotus o-deltoid windings”. I gotta see if this thing is for sale on Amazon!

regarding vacuum pumps, some of them have seals that are incompatible with stabilizing resins, which might be why the Amazon one has such a warning.
 
Not trying to drag this off topic, but a vacuum pump also works great for making clamping devices, and if you have one strong enough, you can do a lot of other neat stuff with one. I’ve heard that welding can be accomplished inside of a good enough vacuum at room temperature, which would be super cool to play around with! I can’t quite afford a pump like that, but it would be fun.
 
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