Pointing out flaws in your work

Alden Cole

Alden Cole

Well-Known Member
I like being honest about my work, but sometimes feel like I harp on what I did wrong more than what I did right, even if it is a very nice knife. What do you point out about a knife you are selling? Scratches, gaps in fitups, thick grinds? Obviously, these things are undesirable, and I won't cheat a customer. On the other hand, no one likes to be shown every last little scratch to the n'th degree on their new knife that they love. So are the only things you point out user things, like, "I wish the steel were a couple rockwell point softer," Or do you also point out cosmetics? Maybe this depends on your customer, as someone who knows a great deal about custom knives will be able to understand your work better. And I'm sure this varies from maker to maker. Interested to hear your thoughts.
 
I make very simple knives, machine finished, nothing fancy. None of them are perfect. But there are certain things that I personally key in on as shoddy, so I make sure I don't let those things out of my shop.
1) Steel is HT properly. If I advertise it at a certain hardness, that's what it is. If it misses the mark, I redo it, or throw it in the pile.
2) No gaps in the handle fit up.
3) No errant deep scratches on the spines or flats.
4) No high pins/fasteners.

Beyond focusing on eliminating those peeves, I concentrate on saying what it is, and being entirely upfront and honest about my work. If it doesn't hit all the marks I personally want it to, I don't let it out of my shop. I use it to test different things; break handles, tips, beat on edges, etc.
 
I totally understand, and have many knives that aren't "sellers" because they were weeded out due to differing reasons. My main point was for knives that you are happy with, good knives with no detrimental flaws. For instance, this knife who doesn't have much of a finger stop, but is otherwise a fine knife. BUT, you can nitpick and say, the sharpening line doesn't flow all the way to the end, etc. etc.

Dymondwood Paring1.JPG
 
Alden Cole said:
I totally understand, and have many knives that aren't "sellers" because they were weeded out due to differing reasons. My main point was for knives that you are happy with, good knives with no detrimental flaws. For instance, this knife who doesn't have much of a finger stop, but is otherwise a fine knife. BUT, you can nitpick and say, the sharpening line doesn't flow all the way to the end, etc. etc.

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That seems more like a design issue than a flaw in your process. At least for this particular example.

I don't make very knives, but I'm much more picky about what goes out the door now than when I first started. The things I look for are good fit up, and no visible flaws. Of course the difference between good fit up when you first start, and when you are a pro or advanced amateur can be major. The same with visible flaws.

I'd say the more picky you are the better. The knife you posted looks more than fine to me. But I think knife makers as a whole are harder on their own work than most potential buyers.

That's my opinion of course. Your mileage may vary
 
Alden Cole said:
I totally understand, and have many knives that aren't "sellers" because they were weeded out due to differing reasons. My main point was for knives that you are happy with, good knives with no detrimental flaws. For instance, this knife who doesn't have much of a finger stop, but is otherwise a fine knife. BUT, you can nitpick and say, the sharpening line doesn't flow all the way to the end, etc. etc.

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I would not explain either of those things.
 
tkroenlein said:
I would not explain either of those things.
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I agree here. I see these the same as, "the handle isn't as dark a brown as I'd like...." which could be totally subjective.

What I would caution you about is to take some time and think about how you will feel about this with 5 more years as a maker under your belt and having these early 'imperfect' blades out there will be real world representatives of your work. They may be your 'early' workmanship, but your workmanship nonetheless.
 
1. Make the very best knives you possibly can.....EVERY SINGLE TIME. (This does NOT mean perfect or flawless.)

2. Never sell (or give away) a knife that isn't covered under point #1. Either fix it, if possible or throw it away.

3. If you are pointing out flaws at the point of sale on a knife that you could have done better at the time, see point #2.

4. At the point of sale, if the knife meets point #1, do not point out any flaws. Stand proud of your work, highlight key features or materials. The buyer has eyes and hands. Let them look and touch. Answer any questions honestly and directly. Do not lie or misrepresent. But if point #1 is met, you are under no obligation to point out flaws. The potential buyer is free to look, observe, ask questions and choose to buy or not.
 
A lot of good advice here. Pretty simple though. If there are obvious flaws it's either fixed or doesn't leave my shop. One thing I like to do when finishing a knife is ask myself " would you hand that knife to a knowledgeable knifemaker and ask for a critique?" Knowing that he will know exactly what to look for when evaluating it.
 
As knifemakers we are hyper critical of our work (or should be!). The more critical you are the flaws start to go away and your work quality goes up. You can't have obvious gaps between materials, crooked grinds, big scratches, flawed finishes, etc.

Your average user won't see some of the flaws that we do and generally won't care. I've handed knives to my friends or family and had them look them over to see if they could spot an issue that I knew was there. Like a small scratch (really faint) in a mirrored bolster or a "foggy" spot on a blade or scale. They never saw it and when I point it out the answer is always "meh, who cares". Then my OCD makes me go fix it! I think the same as Randy does and look at it as if I were another knifemaker looking for issues.

My wife thinks I'm nuts when she sees me with the digital calipers making sure each side of scales/bolsters/etc are exactly the same width.

Now if you are making a display knife for a collector, then no flaws!
 
chrisstaniar said:
when I point it out the answer is always "meh, who cares"
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This is the typical reaction I've always gotten, too.
But I tend to follow-up with, "But you are a friend/relative of mine, and not a random stranger who is paying hundreds of dollars for a tool that they could pay $30 to do the same task."
Sometimes, in the excitement of the moment, things like
chrisstaniar said:
a small scratch (really faint) in a mirrored bolster or a "foggy" spot on a blade or scale
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are not noticed. But what about when they get home, take out the knife and really look over the piece in admiration and the light catches that scratch just right. Unable to un-see things, some folks will now notice that scratch every time they see that side of the knife. And depending on what they consider a lot of money is, they may start having buyer's remorse.
But I tend to always look at the worst case scenario...
 
J. Doyle said:
2. Never sell (or give away) a knife that isn't covered under point #1. Either fix it, if possible or throw it away.
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Yep...I have a friend that always wants "scrap" blades for ranch work. I tell him no because my logo's on the knife and I don't want it getting out there. he just shakes his head when I tell him I snap them in two for a grain "look-see".

knife makers are super self critical...at least the good ones are...
 
Smallshop said:
Yep...I have a friend that always wants "scrap" blades for ranch work. I tell him no because my logo's on the knife and I don't want it getting out there. he just shakes his head when I tell him I snap them in two for a grain "look-see".

knife makers are super self critical...at least the good ones are...
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That is smart to not let an imperfect logo'd knife out the door, and obviously you are under no obligation to your friend to do this, but if you wanted to you could grind out the logo? Or maybe I'm missing something here.
 
Another part of this is many makers keep the not "perfect" knives for self use. I don't carry anything that isn't my best work. I use what I carry as a sales aid. I show it to everyone and have sold many knives this way. Why carry second best? And like many others nothing but my best makes it out alive.
 
Jesse Latham said:
Another part of this is many makers keep the not "perfect" knives for self use. I don't carry anything that isn't my best work. I use what I carry as a sales aid. I show it to everyone and have sold many knives this way. Why carry second best? And like many others nothing but my best makes it out alive.
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Yes...and if someone wants to buy your carry off you there is no stammering and backpedaling necessary...
 
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