New Twist/Scam

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OldGoat

Guest
I don't know what to think about this transaction:
I sold a dagger to a woman in Atlanta. She received it and said there were a couple of hairline cracks in the edge of the blade. She wanted a third off the price of the knife. I said 'no', return the knife within five days (undamaged and unused) and I'd refund her money (as stated on the first page of my web page). She said "no, she would not return the knife until I sent her the refund." I told her that there probably wasn't a business in the country (or the world) that was going to give her her money back until the item was retuned. So, I got another (huffy-sounding) e-mail from her saying that I was not honest and not to ever contact her again.

OK. I can do that. Now I'm wondering if this is a scam just to get reduced prices on knives (or whatever else). I certainly do not want any knife with my name on it and flaw in it sold to anyone. Not that my knives are perfect - there's no such thing - but I try to keep quality high. I certainly didn't see any cracks when it left my shop.

The fact that she refused to return the dagger after I offered her a full refund kind of makes me suspicious. I'm wondering if there really were any cracks. No matter now. An important thing to consider is whether it's smart to give anyone a discount for a flaw. This could lead to buyers claiming flaws on everything. So, I figured I'd better just get the piece back if she wasn't satisfied with it.

I thought I'd spread the word about this type of "scam", if it is one.
 
Jeff Pearce said:
Have her take pictures and send you a copy...to show proof...
Click to expand...

I thought of that - later. Next time, if there is a next tiime, I'll do that. But, I think I could photoshop in a few convincing cracks. The more I think about it, the more I think she was scamming me. Why wouldn't she take a full refund?

Thanks
 
SCAM!!!! Did that sound like I was shouting? Good! What would anyone want with a knife with cracks in it,,,, IN THE CUTTING EDGE??? It's all history now but there are lots of K Dogs in the Atlanta area who could have been "your local representative" who would have been more than happy to have gone over and inspected the knife. Or,,,,you are going to be at the Blade Show arn't you and you could have had a very interesting face to face visit. Ha! I will just bet that if you had told her that your local representative would be over tomorrow to pick up the knife and give her her money back she would have refused.
 
how did "she" pay you?

i will tell you my thoughts, and it's nothing more then thoughts.

what if there were cracks, and she is now as suspicious as you are about her "scamming" you?

i got "frauded" 2 times by what i thought where reputable knifemaker's, both times if i had done how they told me, i would have been out of the evidence, and quite a bit of my money.

for photoshopping a picture to a knife showing crack's - well, that ain't gonna happen, unless your scammer is also a photshop-pro.

greetings,
olli
 
She paid with a check. I offered a 100% refund if she would return the knife. She refused. She wanted me to send her the refund and then she'd send me the knife. I was born at night, but it wasn't last night. Does anyone know of any retailer anywhere who would give a refund for a product without first getting the product back? Or, make a price adjustment without first seeing the 'problem'?

I agree with Wayne Coe. Why would anyone want to keep a knife that had a cracked edge? Especially after being offered a full refund? If I were going to steal her money, I sure wouldn't have sent her the knife - I'd have just kept the money. I think there were no cracks and it was an attempt to get something for nothiing.
 
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did that check clear? i'm just asking because they can be revoked.

keeping a knife with a flaw is odd, no questions asked - but there's always two sides :)
 
I had a similar incident happen to me (as a customer) when I purchased a blade from a maker over on BF. The only difference being that when I contacted him about the knide I provided photos of the damage. I'm not sure what happened, but I believe maybe he had fully neutralized his etching solution when he marked his blade. It was pitted with rust when I received it.

Of course, the maker was a stand up and honorable man and immediately
refunded 100% of the purchase price plus shipping and return shipping cost. As you noticed, I provided photographic evidence of the damage when I contacted him. If I ever find myself noticing another blade by this maker that I take a fancy to, I will have no problem dealing with him again.

I believe you were correct in being cautious with this customer. If she was a "regular customer", I would see no problem in taking her word but a first timer and no evidence throws up a red flag. Stick by your decision on this one. If she has issues, I'd drive to Atlanta to inspect it for you.
 
There is at least one KD forum moderator that lives in the Atlanta metro area... plus an unknown number of other forumites and a couple of those have maker forums also. Plenty of knowledgeable and objective judges available just in case she initiates contact again.
 
Sounds a little too suspicious to me. Offering the full refund upon return was about a fair as you could be.

Here's another one to watch out for: Last Thursday I got an email that seemed legit...a guy wanting to purchase on the knives listed on my website. At first everything seemed normal, and I responded with a request for the individual's name and address so I could figure shipping.....he replied back telling me that the was thrilled that he was getting the knife, and that he wanted to pay with a Cashier's Check....but did not send me the information I requested. Next email comes in on Saturday, saying that he is ready to pay, and that he wants me to ship the knife the South Africa! I again asked for his name and address, and added that I would only ship the knife to HIS address, and that nothing would ship until the cashier's check cleared......that was the last I've heard from him. I back traced the email and it had been routed through severs across Europe and South America. These people!
This is one of the reasons why I never include shipping costs in the price of a knife...it forces me to request the individual's Name and address, which in this case probably saved me being scammed.
 
It's a shame we have to be so cautious with our dealings with people. I have been in several businesses over my life and it's unbelievable the stunts people will try to pull to get something for nothing.

Sooner or later we get nailed by someone and it can really hurt if it's a lot of money. You just have to be careful and not leave yourself open for these scams the best you can.

Larry
 
I think the proof that she was a thief is that she was willing to keep the knife if you refunded 1/3 of the price but would not send it back for a full refund. I was in the air cond. business for 21 years and ran another mans business for 12 years prior to that, Ive seen this type of thief manny times. You handeld the situation properly, dont feel the least bit guilty about it.
 
Thanks to all.

Finally, after I wouldn't give in on my offer to refund her money, she got all huffy and said not to ever contact her again. I don't like to have an unhappy customer, but there doesn't seem to be anything within reason I can do.
 
OldGoat said:
Thanks to all.

Finally, after I wouldn't give in on my offer to refund her money, she got all huffy and said not to ever contact her again. I don't like to have an unhappy customer, but there doesn't seem to be anything within reason I can do.
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Some people are determined to go through life unhappy and strive to make every one they deal with unhappy as well, there is NOTHING you can do about it. Forget about it.
 
I think offering a full refund, on return of the knife, within a reasonable amount of time, is perfectly reasonable. You're right that virtually no other business would do otherwise. At the most they might offer "store credit" after 30 or 90 days, not cash... again, AFTER getting the product back. Many deduct a 10-15% restocking fee even then.

To cover your butt it's good to let those sorts of conditions be known clearly before any money ever changes hands.

She was trying to rip you off, dude.
 
I think you were ABOUT TO GET SCAMED! Stop and think about it.

She paid with a check. When I accept a check I will not ship the knife till the check clears my bank. Been there done that, enough said! huh1

She says you sent her knife with cracks in it and she wants 1/3 off, but not a full refund! :unsure: That don't even make sense!


Now I agree there is not a manufacturer out there that is not going to ask for there product back before issuing a refund. One this lets the manufacturer examine the merchandise to make sure the customer is telling it straight up and Two it also takes the defective product off the market.

She would have got a full refund if she had sent it back and you and her are both would have been happy! She then could have repurchased or not but she would have got all her money back that way!!!!!!!:rolleyes:

You gave her the right options. Some folks are honest and some are like my signature says, God is great, beer is good, and people are CRAZY!:D:D
 
Ide say super SCAM , you said has anyone ever got a refund with out proving damage and I have with tandy leather 3 times now . I have broke tools and told them about it they say no problem new one is coming with your order. Ive broke several stamps and thonging chisles and other tools and they send me another on my word. I am an overly honest person he must hear it in my voice lol .kellyw
 
If you did send out a knife with a crack you ought to feel obliged to get the knife back and out of the customer's hands, and to recompense them. You tried this to the best of your ability, so I see no reason you should question yourself. No responsible craftsman would knowingly sell a product which they knew to be defective, and this is more or less what she asked you to do, albeit after the original sale.
The other possibility is that the blade was not cracked and she was trying to scam you. Either way there is really no better response you could have given. Sending her any money without having the knife returned first would just have been foolish.
 
Be careful with "Clear the Bank", after doing business with the same bank for while they will deposit the $$ into the account before the check or money order is actually cleared. Then if there is a problems the withdraw the funds, call and make sure they have fully cleared the tranaction with the other bank.
 
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