Folder washers, What material is best?

rhinoknives

rhinoknives

Well-Known Member
Well it looks like I am going to make a few small folders and I was looking for some feedback from folder makers about the different materials used.

I think I want to start with just washers and leave the bearing systems to a later project.

So there looks to be? Plastic. Teflon. Brass. Bronze or Stainless, I sure someone makes a Ceramic, but we can pass on them for now.

Because my shop is by the ocean my first instinct is to go with plastic, teflon or stainless
with my first choice being stainless.

So, folder makers, in your experence what are the advantages or disadvantage of each material as far as longevity, ease of use etc?? I am not concerned with cost on these and did I miss any materials that work well for folder washers?

Thanks.

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
Hi Lawrence.
I would not use Teflon. It will change size with compression. I prefer phosphor bronze or as it will often go by bronze. I have done a few in stainless when having to make something special. They don't seem to be commonly available. Special compressed plastic that is available for industrial use is something I have also used but have found that in time the washer surfaces can become scuffed. I don't know it this causes more resistance to opening and closing but having gone from smooth to rough makes me avoid these. In industry they are used as non moveable shims. As an add on I recommend the use of large washers and pivots rather than the common size of 1/8 if room allows. This a far more larger bearing surface for the sides of the blade as well for the inside of the pivot hole. I believe Calvin Robinson is going for this in slip joints; I went to this a few months bar on any of my liner locks it would fit into. 3/16 is now my pivot size of choice. Good doin's on the folders, Laurence. Frank
 
Frank,
Thanks, I thought the plastic would be the first to go and I wasn't sure about the Teflon, As far as changing sizes with compression, do they change back to the original size or do you lose some thickness? Also as far as these additional washers are concern? You mean to have two washers on both side of the blade? Or just a large washer with one on each side of the blade?

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
I like using teflon washers but like Frank says, you have to allow for compression and make your backspacer or standoffs a little thinner. About 0.005" seems to work well for me when using washers that are 0.020" thick. On slipjoints, I just relieve the liners. Every folder maker seems to have a personal preference so I'd say try them all and see what you like.
Phil
 
Lawrence,
I use phosphor bronze on my liner locks and am very happy with them,1/8" ID X 3/8" OD X .010" thick.
 
Calvin Robinson said:
Lawrence,
I use phosphor bronze on my liner locks and am very happy with them,1/8" ID X 3/8" OD X .010" thick.
Click to expand...

Calvin,
Have you seen any problems with oxidation of the Bronze? I know the phosphor is to help fight that?
Thanks, I have some 1/8" pivots I will use for my prototype. I am making it out of Plexiglass.

Anyone else care to add their experence here with the folder washer materials?

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
I make my own washers from brass shim stock to suit each knife.

I agree with Frank about using 3/16" pivots. That's about all I use too.
 
Laurence, The Teflon when compressed will stay compressed the plastic and metal ones do not compress. No there does not seem to be a problem if you use ones made from bronze for corrosion.
 
rhinoknives said:
Calvin,
Have you seen any problems with oxidation of the Bronze? I know the phosphor is to help fight that?
Thanks, I have some 1/8" pivots I will use for my prototype. I am making it out of Plexiglass.

Anyone else care to add their experence here with the folder washer materials?


Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
Click to expand...

Laurence,
If your concerned about oxidation of the bronze because you live near the ocean,don't be.
I live near the Gulf of Mexico,the weather here is subtropical five months out of the year.
The biggest problem I see with liner lock knives is pocket lint!
 
Calvin,
Thanks, Any old knives knives I own with copper or yellow brass turn to a green lump around here pretty quick! I think the Phosphorus will do its thing! I guess it's what they put in marine brass?

As far as lint goes, my two cents is to use a wax lube product instead of a oil for pivots and a protectant.
The lint problem will disappear quickly!

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
I used nytrol (I thin that's what it was) that. Got from McMaster Carr and punched out myself. They synthetic washers will give you a little leeway in your build.

i use phosphor bronze now that I have a surface grinder, the bronze are unforgiving. They usually benefit from a quick lap on some 400 ish grit paper on something flat, just a touch to debur it. Sometime you will get a deformed washer and this will show you before it ends up in a knife, driving you crazy.
 
Les George said:
I used nytrol (I thin that's what it was) that. Got from McMaster Carr and punched out myself. They synthetic washers will give you a little leeway in your build.

i use phosphor bronze now that I have a surface grinder, the bronze are unforgiving. They usually benefit from a quick lap on some 400 ish grit paper on something flat, just a touch to debur it. Sometime you will get a deformed washer and this will show you before it ends up in a knife, driving you crazy.
Click to expand...
Les,
Thanks for the pointer on lapping the bronze washers. I have a order of them on the way in.

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
rhinoknives said:
Les,
Thanks for the pointer on lapping the bronze washers. I have a order of them on the way in.

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
Click to expand...

Les post reminded me to tell you how to flatten your washers. You would think that they come to you flat but that is not so.
I do what Les said,rub them lightly on both sides on some worn out 400 grit paper that is glued to a granite slab,this will show you how warped they are. Then I lay the washer on a 1-2-3 block,put a flat,1/4" piece of linen micarta on top and whack it with a mallet, turn the washer over and do the other side then rub it again on the sandpaper,this will show you if it is still warped,if so repeat the whacking and check again. I do not lap the washers to get them flat,I only rub them lightly to show the warpage and flatten them with the whacking.
A warped washer will drive you crazy and they all are warped to some extent,some of them are so bad you have to discard them.
DON'T FORGET TO WHACK YOUR WASHERS!:biggrin:
 
Calvin Robinson said:
Les post reminded me to tell you how to flatten your washers. You would think that they come to you flat but that is not so.
I do what Les said,rub them lightly on both sides on some worn out 400 grit paper that is glued to a granite slab,this will show you how warped they are. Then I lay the washer on a 1-2-3 block,put a flat,1/4" piece of linen micarta on top and whack it with a mallet, turn the washer over and do the other side then rub it again on the sandpaper,this will show you if it is still warped,if so repeat the whacking and check again. I do not lap the washers to get them flat,I only rub them lightly to show the warpage and flatten them with the whacking.
A warped washer will drive you crazy and they all are warped to some extent,some of them are so bad you have to discard them.
DON'T FORGET TO WHACK YOUR WASHERS!:biggrin:
Click to expand...

Calvin,
Another fine point you have brought up!
I will be sure to Whack My Washers!

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
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