Bringing them something they already have...

Jeremiah, I am a little late to this topic but I'll offer a comment.

I think the question you are asking, if I'm not mistaken is this: "If all mankind is God's creation, and they already know of God, why do missionaries feel the need to spread the word of God?" Meaning then, that missionaries would be unnecessary or maybe wrong for they would then assume that God didn't do a complete job and needed the help of missionaries. I hope I understand you correctly.

The question may not be a simple one to answer and understanding the answer may require a fairly good grasp of the entire Christian bible from beginning to end.

One thing to remember, the knowledge of God the creator is not the same as the knowledge of Jesus the Savior. The first answers to the testimony of the Kingdom of God while the second answers to the testimony of the gospel of grace of our Lord Jesus Christ.

For example: A native in the deepest darkest places of the Amazon jungle may have some instilled sense of wonder and appreciation for the beautiful creation around him but he may have absolutely no knowledge of Jesus the Savior. This is where the missionaries come in. They preach the testimony of Jesus Christ the savior to all tribes and peoples. The bible indicates that all men are responsible for their senses (sight, hearing, smells etc..) thus no person has an excuse to ignore God. But the gospel of Jesus Christ was presented to the disciples of Christ to spread the good word that we may be 'fishers of men'.

To really grasp the importance of this, one would be well suited to have a good knowledge of the two dispensations of God (Jews and Gentiles)and how he deals with each differently (and why) and the different rewards and dwelling places in the eternal paradise when God creates a new heaven and a new earth. Someone sharing an eternal heavenly paradise as joint heirs with Christ for hearing and receiving the gospel of the grace of Jesus Christ is a different (and better) thing than someone living in an eternal earthly paradise subject to Christ with Him as their King for believing the gospel of the Kingdom of God.

You see, your question is valid but has the potential to get very deep very quickly and without a good strong foundation of knowledge of the word of God, could be difficult to understand.
 
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I have been pondering this for a while. I think I understand Jeremiah's question and may be able to help.

Yes, God's Word is written in nature and Creation, but not everyone can hear It and see It. Yes, people who are sincere, open to It and seek It, can know Christ in the purest sense through His Creation and can experience direct communion with God, naturally... but others seem to be deaf, blinded and indifferent to it.

Jesus often taught in parables to try and open these people's eyes and ears, because they couldn't see and understand the things that were right in front of them, inside them and all around them. They were "hidden truths" for many. It was for these "lost" people wherever they were, that Jesus taught in parables and sent missionaries to teach them about God's Word/Creation and the Kingdom of Heaven....

You can not separate the Creator from the Creation... His Word is here, there and everywhere for all to hear. The Word of God, is Creation! Jesus is the Word of God...

... the Word of God is inside you. In Hinduism and Buddhism this is called the "Atman".

Christ did not come, or send missionaries, to bring glory to Himself, but rather to His Father in Heaven and the wonder of His Creation.

These links might help shed some light on it. Hope it helps.

http://www.whiteestate.org/books/col/col1.html

http://www.cqbiblestudy.org/article...first-quarter-2014/1q14-lesson-2#.VQC7PNJ0zre

http://languages.bibleschools.com/guides/lotw/lotwsg18.htm
 
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Romans 1:20 NIV

"For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse."
 
  • [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
    [*][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Bible is not, as the Bible-ists would have others believe, the "Word of God".[/FONT]    [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Bible is, rather, a complex and often contradictory recording of innumerable oral histories. In many cases those oral histories are of uncertain origin. And there is no one Bible. There are thousands of translations of that record of oral histories, modified by various religious persuasions to suit their own purposes.[/FONT]
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And that was enough for me.... I guess you can imagine I strongly disagree with the above statement from "the true christian".net.

This one I agree with: http://www.bibchr.com/bib_christ.html

My thoughts on this, and I'm going to be blunt about it...
God is obvious to anyone who takes the time to think about it. Look at the street lights, you know someone had to install the wires and hook up the bulbs... now look up at the stars, are they any different? God is as evident as the nose on your face, and anyone who thinks otherwise is deceiving themselves.

Knowing God exists is not Christianity, and has very little to do with it really. Everyone knows God exists, whether they'll admit it or not. Read Acts 10, note that Cornelius was devout and God-fearing, yet was in need of salvation. Note in Acts 16 that Lydia was a worshiper of God, yet was unsaved until she heard the gospel and believed it.

It is all about the good news (gospel) of Jesus Christ (messiah), and his perfect sacrifice. You have to believe that Jesus was crucified and died for your sins, and that God raised him from the dead, in the process demonstrating that his sacrifice was sufficient, and that all who believe in it are redeemed. Christianity is really as simple as that. All you have to do is believe, and you have eternal life.

The bible, off the top of my head, is the redemption story, written over a period of 5000 odd years by more than 40 different authors, who were inspired by the Holy Spirit. It tells us why we need to be redeemed in the first place, why we could not redeem ourselves, and how God accomplished it for us through his son. It tells us believers who we are and what we have in Christ. It is possible to be a believer in Christ's sacrifice without the bible, one only needs to hear the good news and believe it. However, one will not know the full truth without God's written word, they will not know the full extent of their redemption. A christian who doesn't know who they are in Christ will be little different than any unbeliever. They will never know their inheritance, they will never renew their minds to the fact they are new creations in Christ and no longer slaves to sin, and will live defeated lives no different that the average lost person.

I call this state being saved but stuck, and I suppose the majority of christians are there. They are ignorant, but this ignorance can be cured with a little knowledge. The bible contains the knowledge to live a victorious life.
 
GHEzell said:
And that was enough for me.... I guess you can imagine I strongly disagree with the above statement from "the true christian".net.

This one I agree with: http://www.bibchr.com/bib_christ.html

My thoughts on this, and I'm going to be blunt about it...
God is obvious to anyone who takes the time to think about it. Look at the street lights, you know someone had to install the wires and hook up the bulbs... now look up at the stars, are they any different? God is as evident as the nose on your face, and anyone who thinks otherwise is deceiving themselves.

Knowing God exists is not Christianity, and has very little to do with it really. Everyone knows God exists, whether they'll admit it or not. Read Acts 10, note that Cornelius was devout and God-fearing, yet was in need of salvation. Note in Acts 16 that Lydia was a worshiper of God, yet was unsaved until she heard the gospel and believed it.

It is all about the good news (gospel) of Jesus Christ (messiah), and his perfect sacrifice. You have to believe that Jesus was crucified and died for your sins, and that God raised him from the dead, in the process demonstrating that his sacrifice was sufficient, and that all who believe in it are redeemed. Christianity is really as simple as that. All you have to do is believe, and you have eternal life.

The bible, off the top of my head, is the redemption story, written over a period of 5000 odd years by more than 40 different authors, who were inspired by the Holy Spirit. It tells us why we need to be redeemed in the first place, why we could not redeem ourselves, and how God accomplished it for us through his son. It tells us believers who we are and what we have in Christ. It is possible to be a believer in Christ's sacrifice without the bible, one only needs to hear the good news and believe it. However, one will not know the full truth without God's written word, they will not know the full extent of their redemption. A christian who doesn't know who they are in Christ will be little different than any unbeliever. They will never know their inheritance, they will never renew their minds to the fact they are new creations in Christ and no longer slaves to sin, and will live defeated lives no different that the average lost person.

I call this state being saved but stuck, and I suppose the majority of christians are there. They are ignorant, but this ignorance can be cured with a little knowledge. The bible contains the knowledge to live a victorious life.
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George,
Thank you for replying to this,you nailed it!
Tai,apostasy is what that is,it's a lie,it's the lie that we are warned about in the Bible.
For God's sake,and your sake,READ THE BIBLE! instead of junk like this.
 
I have and do Calvin.

Knowing God is the first step and where it all begins. He can be known through his creation... He is the beginning and the end.

The bible tells the story of the "Three Wise Men" who followed a star to Bethlehem. If the only way to know about Jesus is through the bible, how do you explain the three wise men? The Magi? My opinion is that "Christianity" does not have a monopoly on Jesus... I'm sorry and apologies if anyone is offended.

The bible is the probably best/easiest way to learn about Jesus,... but not the only way. If you don't believe me, check your bibles. :)
 
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The bible tells the story of the "Three Wise Men" who followed a star to Bethlehem. If the only way to know about Jesus is through the bible, how do you explain the three wise men
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Real easy they read the tora or old testament if you prefer. There are hunderds of prophecy pointing to Jesus throught the old testament. Again the Bible showed them where to look

but not the only way. If you don't believe me, check your bibles.
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Where in the Bible dose Jesus say "don't look for me in my fathers word?"

John 1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.2 He was with God in the beginning.3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.4 In him was life,and that life was the light of all mankind.5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

John 14:
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Matthew 5:17
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or theProphets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

Read Matthew 4 What dose Jesus use to respond to Satin himself? The word of God and nothing else

I have got to go to bed so Good night all
 
"Sola scriptura" is a doctrine,... not a biblical fact.

The theologians have been debating these things for centuries. I don't think we need to. We're just lowly knifemakers.

I guess I was just agreeing with Jeremiah on a few points and you guys on others... looking for that sweet spot. :)
 
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