Warped Stabilized Wood Scales

Grizzly Bear

Well-Known Member
Hey guys, have any of you gotten warped stabilized wooden scales from a retail vendor? I thought stabilized scales were not suppose to warp. When I unwrapped the scales (California Burl Wood) they looked great. I re-wrapped them in their original packaging and placed them in a file cabinet in my closet. 4 months later I took them out and one of the scales was warped by about 1/6". What happened? I do live in New Orleans, do you think they warped because of the humidity?

I look forward to your input. I intend to grind the scales on my grinder to get rid of the warp. I guess this will work.

Many Thanks,

Grizzly Bear
 
Stabilizing reduces but often does not eliminate warping from humidity changes. Some processes are also better than others. Sand them flat on one side. If they are too far gone, nothing to loose by soaking in hot water a bit and putting them under heavy flat weights for a month or two as they dry back out.
 
It also depends on where you live to some extent.
The wood, even though its stabilized may gain or loose a few points of moisture and that may be the reason.

Whenever I use buy natural handle materials, stabilized or not. I let them hang out in my shop for at least a month or two to climatize to my local amount of moisture since I live by the ocean, it can move a little. Then I true it up again before mounting them.
 
Thanks a lot guys. I guess living in New Orleans by the ocean below sea level is the culprit.

God Bless

Grizzly Bear
 
The real 'culprit' is that it's a natural material still and nothing, no not even stabilizing, is going to prevent it from doing whatever it wants to do naturally.

Tracy said it best. Stabilizing *may* help reduce movement. Nothing is a guarantee with any natural materials.

I think stabilizing is one of the most over-hyped, over-sold and most misunderstood aspects of our craft.

Having the wood be dry is THE most important thing to scales being 'stable'. Introduce moisture due to seasonal changes, climate or humidity changes and there most likely will be some movement, stabilized or not.
 
Stabilizing is the closest thing to wood magic I have found - though I echo Boss' comment about some being better than others. The process will improve the durability of just about anything that will absorb it. It greatly reduces movement and cracking due to moisture and temperature. Having said that, burl wood by it's nature is under immense stress from the multidirectional and multistructural nature of it's growth. When the ball is slabbed, much of that stress is just begging to move around - even if it's been stabilized. Stabilizing allows us to use pieces that would not have been useable at all - and even nice dry hard pieces will withstand a little more abuse than without

If something bad happens to a stabilized piece, I believe something worse would have happened without it. At the very least, I believe it meets the test of "do no harm".

In answer to the obvious questions, no, I am not a stabilizer. All wood that leaves here is professionally stabilized (if it can be) - because I believe in it.

(You didn't expect all the answers you got to be in agreement did you?) :biggrin:

Rob!
 
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Well guys, I'm learning that stabilization is not the panacea I thought it was, but I can see how it helps. Sorry to hear how unstable burl is. I really like the way it looks.

I bought some mammoth toot scales and a block that has been stabilized. I hope I don't have problems with it too. I'm keeping my finger's crossed on that one.

I am going to be in a mess if the humidity is causing my problems since I leave near New Orleans and it rains here most of the time.

Do you think I will have problems once I put the burl scales on with epoxy and pin it good?

God Bless,

Grizzly Bear
 
Years back,I sent some steak knives to coastal Georgia. The handles were stabilized Thuya Burl (a very difficult material to stabilize). Though the agreement was for gentle handwash, they soon were tossed into bus tubs and put through a commercial dishwasher several times a day. Four years later, they returned about half of them for refinishing. Sometimes things work better than you thought. Sometime not so much.

If you want something really stable, consider G10. The natural beauty of wood is still available. It just benefits from things like stabilization, high quality adhesives, mechanical support (Corby's) and design. The extra effort is part of what separates handcrafted knives from the Walmart offerings. :)
 
I'll toss in my limited experience with stabilized wood (both K&G and Cactus Juice) and say "It depends - on the wood and who does the stabilizing" to a great extent. All the commercially stabilized wood I've used has been done by K&G and in each case that wood is 100% penetrated by the resin and it works much like a epoxy block of fiberglass. Has a totally different smell/feel than natural wood, but still looks like wood. I can't imagine that stuff moving once it's done. I'm here just outside Mobile, AL where it's about the same as New Orleans for humidity - wet year round. If the block of wood doesn't have the same resin in the center as on outside - not stabilized properly, or wood isn't good for stabilizing.

Some woods such as Thuya burl - can't imagine that would soak up much resin - it's full of resin already.

edit: with all that said, stabilized wood can still wrap - heck, even steel will warp under some conditions..... just get it too hot on one side.

Ken H>
 
I've had both stabilized and not stabilized wood move in Montana and here in Michigan with just the changing of the seasons. Montana was very dry and Michigan is humid in the summer and dry in the winter.

I have a kitchen knife with ironwood scales. Every winter, it shrinks up and you can feel the pins and catch your thumbnail on the edge of the tang. Every summer it swells slightly and the pins are flush and you can't catch the tang with your thumbnail.

The movement is VERY slight, so we're not talking huge amounts here. Stabilized wood is the same way. But it gets presented all the time that stabilized wood is 100% sealed and WILL NOT move. That's just not true. I've had stabilized wood warp, several times. Buckeye burl, redwood burl, amboyna burl, maple burl, spalted maple. I've had all of these move on me. And I'm VERY careful working it as far as temperature and introducing stresses to it via machining. All of it was stabilized and all of it can move with moisture changes. Not a lot but enough to notice and shoot the theory professed by some that stabilized wood is sealed and impervious to moisture and movement.

Amboyna is one wood where in my experiences, stabilizing did more harm than good. Professionally stabilized, and cut from the same big block side by side, I had one block stabilized and one not. The stabilized block came back all full of checks and cracks and bowed quite badly. I milled it flat and left it sit for two months. It continued to crack and check. The unstabilized block is going strong to this day. moisture on both was 6-8% before stabilizing.

African blackwood is the only wood that I've never noticed any type of movement. I'd be interesting if some of you guys tried this and reported your findings. Make some scales, get them dead flat. Scales that are truly flat will almost stick together from vacuum pressure when you press them together. You can feel it. Anyway, make some scales, get them dead flat and then let them sit for a month or two and see if they're still dead flat. I bet most would notice some slight warp or curl. Not much mind you, and good epoxy and pins would hold them forever....but most will have moved slightly I'm betting.

I will say that I use stabilized wood quite a bit. But a lot of it is because that's what the market really demands, not because I think it really needs it. There is no doubt that stabilizing adds some weight to the wood and in some woods, like redwood and buckeye for example, it makes a seemingly noticeable difference in surface hardness. I'm not sure it really makes it that much more 'stable' as I still maintain that wood being dry and seasoned is what has the largest effect on it's stability.

But stabilizing is relatively new. Look at all the weapons they've unearthed that had wood handles still largely intact after spending a hundred years or more in many cases underground. You can't tell me a wood handle that's not stabilized is going to twist and warp and fall apart in a matter of a few months or even a few years. Use something suitable, not pine or green willow, and finish it properly and take care of it and it will last a lifetime.

Just my two cents relating my experiences with all woods, stabilized or not.
 
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Thanks for the input John. I've made two knives using un-stabilized king wood. I just used a Tung oil finish. I have not heard any complaints from my buyers yet.

I bought the stabilized burl because that is what they were selling and I thought I needed it.

I'm thinking now that I need to treat the burl scales (after I grind them flat) like mammoth scales. Charles Turner coats his mammoth scales with CA (thin super glue) to make them more stable when grinding or drilling them. Do you guy's think coating them in CA will keep them from warping after I true them up?

Thanks for the help,

Grizzly Bear
 
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