Stabilization at home??

C

Cabinetmaker

Well-Known Member
I have been collecting some nice blocks of wood that I have kicking around the shop. And, I put the word out to some of my friends that are cabinetmakers, and several of them have come through with some pieces as well. So I have pretty good size pile that needs stabilization. I already have a large industrial vacuum pump that I use for veneer work.
My question is this. Can I expect professional quality results if I set up to stabilize in my shop? I see the words "professionally stabilized" quite often. This implies to me that the thought is it it not good enough to do it at home.
Please, all opinions are welcome! For and against with reasons.
Thanks, Larry
 
All depends on the wood - American Black Walnut doesn't seem to take to home stabilization very well, nor does some other woods. An open pore wood, spalted wood, and stuff like that does do very good. By good I mean it soaks up enough resin to sink in water after stabilization. I use Cactus Juice with a decent vac pump and like my results for some woods. BUT - if you've got a good size pile (10 lb or so?) of good wood, I'd send to K&G, or one of the other places. I've used several blocks of K&G stabilized wood and they get resin completely thru wood that my home method won't even think of.

Like myself who only has a few scales from time to time, and making sure the wood is an open pore wood, I'm happy with Cactus Juice.

Ken H>
 
It is also going to depend on the species of wood whether or not it can be stabilized. Send something like African black wood or one of the others in the Rosewood family and K&G will send it right back to you. Those woods are too dense and oily to get the resin through. Plus they are so stable as they come I don't know why someone would try. Then there are other woods that will do just fine without stabilization though they can be, something like Osage Orange. You just have to know your woods.

Doug
 
The do it yourself stuff for stabilization is far better than a few years ago but it will still take you a while to get it right! You need to chat up someone that's be doing it for awhile and then give yourself some trial & error room.

I personally stick with Professionally done stuff from Faron Moore's Custom's & Mark's stuff from its a burl. which is done by K & G. Both of them have sub forums here. There is Mike at WSSI also. I like to focus on my knife patterns and grinding them and want the best stabilized woods for my handles.
Bossdog here sells some great stabilized woods of professional origins.

Most everyone with a can of mini wax hardener a Brake pump and a large Mason jar calls themselves a professional stabilizer these days.
When I started making knives there were three companies. WSSI, K & G and one on the east coast that I can't remember right now.
 
At Johnny Stout's last Hammer-In, I sat through a class presented by Curtis Seebeck of Cactus Juice. I was under the impression that if it wasn't professionally stabilized by a company like K&G or WSSI, it would be garbage. I have totally changed my opinion on that. A high quality stabilizing job can certainly be performed "at home" but it does require an investment in the proper equipment. I know Johnny stabilizes pretty much everything he uses on his knives including ivory and stag.

Bob
 
Bob, I have talked with Curtis at length getting my stabilization with Cactus Juice working good. While Cactus Juice is good, even Curtis says it doesn't work very good at all for woods such as American Black Walnut and similar woods. K&G can do Black Walnut just fine - I think anyway. Perhaps someone can comment on that? I have tried Claro Walnut and it doesn't work very good either - same results as with Black Walnut. There are some woods and things that work really good with Cactus Juice - you just have to pick your material with an eye to the open type pores.

That's why I recommend the OP to sent to K&G or one of the other stabilizing places - they can handle most any wood that improves with stabilization.

Ken H>
 
Thanks for the opinions guys! Still hoping to hear from more knifedogs (pro or hobbyist) about their thoughts and experiences with home stabilization.
 
Hey - call Curtis with Cactus Juice and talk to him. Tell him what woods you have you wish to stabilize and he'll be able to provide good info as to the suitability for home stabilization.

AND - one thing we should have asked, are you looking for something to do this one big batch of wood? OR - looking to do some all along for yourself? What woods do you have?

AND - since you've got the vacuum pump, it does't cost much to try it. Purchase a qt of Cactus Juice, right up a simple vac camber that will hold vac and a small volume for test run and try a block or two of wood. See what it does.

Ken H>
 
Ken, have you ever seen a 2 blocks from same tree stabilized with Cactus Juice in one and the pros stuff in the other? I've been curious how they would compare. I did some with Cactus Juice, but that's the only reference I have. Not knowing what to expect, some of the wood I did seemed like it didn't feel much different than when it when in. I know it soaked up a bunch of the juice and seemed to cure well. I just like to see a side by side.

On another note, I've got some pics and notes of my low buck vacuum chamber. If anybody is interested, I could post a WIP.
 
Anthony, Nope - never seen the same wood from same tree with the two different methods. One of the "easy" ways to get a decent idea of effectiveness of stabilization is drop in pan of water. Does the stabilized wood float or sink? How high in water does the wood float prior to stabilizing, and does it float at all, just level with water?

I stabilized some spalted pecan that really did good - sinks after stabilizing. Other woods didn't do as well... I tried Claro Walnut that I expected to really do good, but it didn't do as well as I hoped. It did help, but not the sinking as expected.

What woods did you stabilize using Cactus Juice?

Ken H>
 
I have quite a few different species. The largest amount at the moment is probably French Walnut, maybe enough for a couple hundred blocks or so. Few dozen spalted maple, probably a few dozen crotch mahogany, a couple logs of Gaboon Ebony, a log of Pink Ivory. Lacewood, Boxwood, Rosewood, Cocobolo, Purpleheart, Tiger Maple. Most of the exotics were bought for inlay material. I think I could go on a bit more if I really started looking. I have been a furniture maker for 35 years, and always kept the best for myself. I also have many sources in the wood business.
Aside from having a good supply, I like to do things myself. My back yard shop is a proffesional furniture making shop, and if there is anyone out there doing it in a quality way, I would like to learn how. I am not afraid to invest in equipment if this could be a profitable avenue. Just trying to learn what I can.
 
Curly maple, koa, zebra, wenge, sapelle, bokote, dogwood, and more. I just packed a little bit of everything into jar and did them all at the same time, but the only set I've used so far was the koa. It seems good, but again I have nothing to compare to. One tip/warning here, those dark oily woods will tint your juice, be careful mixing woods.

I did buy a set of "stabilized" scales on eBay once, zebra I think, and when I got them home I immediately knew it was a joke. It was one of those minwax jobs and appeared to have barely penetrated the surface. I slapped them on the disc sander used cactus juice on them. I could tell a noticeable difference on those.
 
There is a great video on YouTube by Jackloreknives. He lives in the UK and imports Cactus Juice, but his method is far more intensive than anyone else I have heard from. He bakes the blocks to bring the moisture content down as close to zero as he can. Then he puts them in the chamber with CJ for at least 8 hrs under vacuum with the pump running continuously . Then leaves the blocks in the juice to soak for another 48 hrs. Then he bakes the blocks for 2 hrs. I believe he is getting far better results than most. Check out the video.
 
I'm not going to take a position about how good or bad the do-it-yourself products are, because I have no experience with the current offerings. If you believe that perceptions are important, I can say that our customers are very fussy about who processed wood that we sell as stabilized. I have had substandard product returned to me even by so-called professionals. (Not one of the big two normally referenced).

I guess what I'm saying is that even if you got very good results from your set-up, it may be seen by customers and others as lesser quality. To be clear, I'm not talking about product quality - but about product perception.

Rob!
 
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