Trying a Hawk?

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
Well gonna try making a hawk. I cut a piece of 3/16" mild steel out for a body. Plan on wrapping this "Body" around a pipe/mandrel then putting a piece of High Carbon in between the mild and Forge welding the whole mess together.20190912_152944.jpg

Hopefully it will all work out. Just wanted to try something other than a knife for fun!! I will admit FiF gave me the idea because of their last episode with the boarding axe they had the contestants make.
 

Jon Buescher

Well-Known Member
I have been working on making these, I have had trouble with my forge welds sticking, I’ve made mine from mild steel and 1084, I’ve made a couple that came out ok but the last couple I tried are in my scrap pile, somewhere on here there are some pics, make sure you get that mild steel good and hot! I’m no expert of course, just sharing what I have been experiencing
 

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
I have been working on making these, I have had trouble with my forge welds sticking, I’ve made mine from mild steel and 1084, I’ve made a couple that came out ok but the last couple I tried are in my scrap pile, somewhere on here there are some pics, make sure you get that mild steel good and hot! I’m no expert of course, just sharing what I have been experiencing
Going in a Coal forge. What kinda forge do you have??
 

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
I can get welding temps, i just have trouble getting 1084 to stick to mild steel, its been a fight!
I've had problems in the past until a Blacksmith friend showed me. I just never had enough heat in the work pieces. Thought I did though! He had me bring steel up until it just started to spark in his coal forge (Lemon yellow color in Gas). Then bring out the billet and hit with a bunch of light hits all over billet to set weld, clean the area with a wire brush, reflux it and back into forge for 2 more rounds, second and 3rd round hammer blows are harder to finish the weld. Another thing he said I was doing wrong was over fluxing, I was pouring flux on and this was causing voids in weld area. Believe me I'm no expert but I've had much better success since his advise.
 

EdCaffreyMS

"The Montana Bladesmith"
TEACHING/SHARING/SUGGESTION MOMENT:

IF you can do it this way.....weld your mild steel body together first. Then, get a localized heat in the eye area and drift it to shape. Anneal the entire piece, the carefully cut what will be the cutting edge on a band saw to about 1/2"-34" depth. Create a "bit" of 1080 or 1084 steel of 3/16'-1/4" thickness. (this is where it's best to create a straight edge on the body....and AFTER the bit is forge welded in, forge the edge to a radius.) If you've made a radius edge on the body...... forge the bit to the shape of the edge, and scarf down the back edge....and maybe even "sharpen" it on the grinder.

NOTE: I would discourage using 1095 or higher carbon content for the edge/bit..... since the higher the carbon content, the lower the forge welding temp..... it's very possible that you will "burn" the high carbon bit before the A36 gets to it's welding temp.

Heat the body to near welding heat, and using a hot chisel, GENTLY open of the band saw cut, until it will accept the high carbon bit you make. Flux it, and insert the bit....tap in down until the back edge "cuts" into the back of the split.......this is normally where cold shuts occur if don't "jam" the bit into the back of the cut) Quickly tap down the sides or the cut, and into the forge.....once you get to welding heat, your FIRST hit should be straight down on the edge.....setting the back of the bit into the body.....then working from the back of the bit, LIGHT hammer blows until you have the weld completed.....which will likely take a few heats. Since you've forge welded a bit in there.....it's in your best interest to do any/all additional forge work at welding heat....it will keep things together and prevent cold shuts.

A tip on heat treating: Since the body is mild steel (I'm assuming A36 hot roll) there could be any number of alloys present, and if you heat treat the entire item....it's very likely you will get at the very least hard and soft spots all over, which also means significant warping. May advice on this type of construction it to heat treat only that portion where you've welding the high carbon bit in place...... no soaking....just get that area to the austinizing temp of the high carbon steel, and get it quenched.....the more you allow it to soak, the more like you are to "pop" the forge weld.
 

Redbaird

KNIFE MAKER
This may be a very noob question but why not make it all out of say 1075 and only harden the cutting edge? Wouldn't this be easier?
 

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
This may be a very noob question but why not make it all out of say 1075 and only harden the cutting edge? Wouldn't this be easier?
I was putzing around the shop wanted to make something different and this is what I had in the bin. You could absolutely make it all out of 1075.
 

Gliden07

Well-Known Member
TEACHING/SHARING/SUGGESTION MOMENT:

IF you can do it this way.....weld your mild steel body together first. Then, get a localized heat in the eye area and drift it to shape. Anneal the entire piece, the carefully cut what will be the cutting edge on a band saw to about 1/2"-34" depth. Create a "bit" of 1080 or 1084 steel of 3/16'-1/4" thickness. (this is where it's best to create a straight edge on the body....and AFTER the bit is forge welded in, forge the edge to a radius.) If you've made a radius edge on the body...... forge the bit to the shape of the edge, and scarf down the back edge....and maybe even "sharpen" it on the grinder.

NOTE: I would discourage using 1095 or higher carbon content for the edge/bit..... since the higher the carbon content, the lower the forge welding temp..... it's very possible that you will "burn" the high carbon bit before the A36 gets to it's welding temp.

Heat the body to near welding heat, and using a hot chisel, GENTLY open of the band saw cut, until it will accept the high carbon bit you make. Flux it, and insert the bit....tap in down until the back edge "cuts" into the back of the split.......this is normally where cold shuts occur if don't "jam" the bit into the back of the cut) Quickly tap down the sides or the cut, and into the forge.....once you get to welding heat, your FIRST hit should be straight down on the edge.....setting the back of the bit into the body.....then working from the back of the bit, LIGHT hammer blows until you have the weld completed.....which will likely take a few heats. Since you've forge welded a bit in there.....it's in your best interest to do any/all additional forge work at welding heat....it will keep things together and prevent cold shuts.

A tip on heat treating: Since the body is mild steel (I'm assuming A36 hot roll) there could be any number of alloys present, and if you heat treat the entire item....it's very likely you will get at the very least hard and soft spots all over, which also means significant warping. May advice on this type of construction it to heat treat only that portion where you've welding the high carbon bit in place...... no soaking....just get that area to the austinizing temp of the high carbon steel, and get it quenched.....the more you allow it to soak, the more like you are to "pop" the forge weld.
As always Ed thank you for the input! Planned on doing an edge quench on this, I have a Rosebud torch, figured this would heat it more evenly to help minimize problems. I do very little Forge welding so I'll give this a go!
 
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Sean Jones

Well-Known Member
Tagged for curiosities sake. I have a piece of 1/2 inch road plate that might be useable for such a project sometime in the future.
 
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