San Mai help

L

Leatherface

Well-Known Member
hey guys I got a few questions on what is the best way for a noob to work some san mai

I was thinking of using some 1/4" A36 pieces between a piece of 1/4 1084

if I can find some thinner pieces of A36 that would better?? or thinner 1084?

yea I know that is kinda thick, it its what i have handy and its piratically free

so I was thinking

soak all the scale and crud off of the steel with some white venigar

make sure that all the pieces are flat

wield one end to a rod to handle the stack wield the sides

soak in kerosene for 20 minutes while getting a good coke buring fire going

pull out the bar and lay it in the coals and put the air to it...turning it over in the heat till there is an even light pink color...

pull it out and lightly tap down the bar on both sides to set the weld

add flux all over the bar and put it in the forge again and repeat till needed

how long do I continue to set the weild before I start the actual forging?
anything I miss??
 
Leatherface said:
hey guys I got a few questions on what is the best way for a noob to work some san mai

I was thinking of using some 1/4" A36 pieces between a piece of 1/4 1084

if I can find some thinner pieces of A36 that would better??
Click to expand...

I hope this is a miss print. If you can get some 1018 as opposed to the a36 your thicknesses are ok set the weld and then reheat and go over the bar again then start drawing the bar.
 
Mr Burke
Thank you for your reply

I have access to a bucketload of a36 that is almost free so that is the reasoning behind using it

If it wont work I will try the 1018

If I am not planning on drawing it out very much, can I get away with 1 or 2 heats to set the wield or do I need to draw it out?

Thanks again!
D
 
Dave just curious about the core choice, do you plan on exposing this at the edge or just using the A36 as a soft core?
 
I wanna use the a36 as the outer core...

was thinking of Aldos 1084 as the inner

My idea is a thick camp chopper with a hard edge but a soft body for extra strength
 
Leatherface said:
I was thinking of using some 1/4" A36 pieces between a piece of 1/4 1084
Click to expand...

OK was just checking, seems I misread this line. Thanks for clarifying. I make these often but I use wrought iron instead of mild steel. Have fun and keep us posted.

Also wanted to comment on your stock choice thickness, I generally use the same 1/4" all 3 pieces. I find that wrought draws faster that the carbon steel core and I assume mild will draw faster as well and I have been happy with the results. One thing to keep in mind is forge this from both sides, if you just forge one side you run the chance of shifting the core to one side. Which is usually the hammer side as that side stays hot longer and you anvil will cool the other side faster locking it up.
 
mr Turner,
yea thats what I get for not proofreading bro

sorry for that

anywho


the outer core is a36 and the inner is 1084

never thought of using wrought iron...might have to look into that

how much drawing do you tend to do on blades that thick?? I was thinking of just getting a good wield and banging in so distal taper and calling it a day
 
Well if you start with 3 pieces 1/4" thick that is a starting thickness of 3/4" so you will need to draw it your desired blade thickness I usually leave about 1/16" for clean up. Now forging in bevels and distal taper depends on how much core steel you want exposed.

Wrought is a nice material to work with and because of the slag in it makes it very appealing to the eye IMHO.
 
Mr Turner,
I am going to look for a couple pieces of thin wrought for me to work with

I "think" I can get some thinner stuff at work to use as the out pieces...I have a small piece of 1/8" 1095 laying around here to try out my forge wielding till I can get me a guillotine thingy made to draw out the billet without mashing the good metal off center
D
 
starting with too thin of a core you run the risk of having the soft steel suck all the carbom out of it before you get the blade forged. If you are not very familiar with forge welding Getting a good weld with wrought is tough and I personally have more trouble with A36 than wrought. 1018 has some carbon in it so less carbon migration and it is way easier to get to weld.
 
mr Burke

Ok I will gladly take that advice before I try and tackle some wrought iron and steel


once i get my stuff together I will update ya...

thanks again for you guys help, it is much appreciated by this noob

respect
 
I've made a few of these, and this is how I've done it:

1- Two pieces of 1/8" mild steel (the crap they sell at Home Depot) and one piece of 1/8" high-carbon steel (I've used O1 and 1080)

2- Prep the surfaces clean and flat. Wire together with stainless steel wire, or tack weld the stack if you've got a welder.

3- Heat just hot enough for flux to melt. At this point, you don't want it screaming hot because you don't want scale to form between the laminations before you get the flux in there.

4- When it's hot enough that the flux starts to melt, flux the piss out of it. Cover all seams with a generous amount.

5- Back into the forge, this time get it about as hot as you can without burning it. Make sure the billet is evenly heated throughout.

6- Once it's screaming hot, bring it out and set your weld with a series of *gentle* taps. I start in the middle and work outward in all directions. This keeps you from welding the edges while the center is still "open", trapping flux and crap between the layers.

7- After it's set, re-heat and hit it harder until the weld is complete throughout.

8- At this point, I pretty much forge as I would with a homogeneous piece of stock. It's been mentioned already, but be aware that your milder steel will move a bit more readily than the higher-carbon layer, so you might end up with some of the softer steel squished out over the edge of the core layer; that can be rectified at the grinder if need be.

Again, this is just the way I do it, so take this as only one of many possible ways to accomplish making a laminated blade.
 
one thing to remember is that Flux is not glue. If you have flat clean pieces of steel you do not need a lot of flux just enough to cover the billet. I use about a tablespoon full. too much flux can be as bad as not enough and can actually make it easier to trap flux in a billet. the simple way is to completely weld the billet and use no flux. make your high carbon piece a little smaller than the cladding so that there is a shallow groove all the way around the billet then fill it with weld.
 
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