Anyone use one of these on a forge??

Well I hope I haven't goofed but I took a chance on this blower from Ebay. I paid $10.49 shipping and all to me I will have a Grand Total of $27.48. in it! The add said they did not know if it ran or not. Look at the connection on the end of the cord. I know why they didn't know if it ran or not. You have to have the other side of that connection to be able to plug it up. So I decided to take a chance. My way of thinking is if the motor is bad I can use a motor I have here at the house to power it! We will see when the Fedex truck arrives! I have lost more than that in the opening at the poker table! :what!::biggrin:

:jawdrop:Come on now, I know it is not one of these

http://www.blacksmithsdepot.com/products/forge-fan-fuel/forge-blowers.html

but, 31 views and not a comment! I think it will work OK for a blower!!!

I have no ideal what it is but I use to use a hairdryer for my blower, so if it blows I would say it would work. I hope it does work for you!

Cliff, I don't have a clue what type of blower that is, but if the motor tag says 120vac (or 240vac if you've got it available) it should work just fine. The plug on end doesn't mean much at all, just whack it off and put right plug on. From looking at photo, it does look like it'd move a lot of air. For $27 you've not gambled a lot.

Ken H>

Yes,

Some of us do. This particular blower puts out 84 CFM, works like the dickens. This was a test run before adding the gas needle valve. The blower worked out just right but if yours puts out too many CFM for the size forge, you may have to use a gate valve to control air flow. Beats the heck out of a venturi burner. After installing the needle valve, the forge welds at 8-10# and forges down at 3# only adjusting the flambaster air restrictor on the squirrel cage.


Rudy

Hey guys last night I put together this thread and then it was completely edited and changed. I was watching one of these on EbayDAYTON 1TDN1 Shaded Pole Blower,115 Volt






So I am trying to get some info on whether they will work for a blower on a forge. They usually sell for around $50-70 and this one was still at a reasonable rate. Soooooooooooooo while I am waiting to see if anyone on the forum is going to share with me their knowledge. I am busy Googling any and all info I can pull up on the Dayton blowers. Up pops the one I had bought. I had saw it before and it says used and they could not verify that it ran but that it wasn't frozen up. It had a little over 10 min. left on the auction! No reserve and the buyer would have to start at the $10.49 to bid on it!

So that told me enough to play a little poker. I figure that if they said it was not frozen that means they had spun the fan. If it had turned, that is good and if it didn't squall and flop all around that means they didn't throw it into the scrap pile. The plug is a type often used in medical settings, I know that because my son-in-law works for a very large company that handles a lot of that type of equipment. So I had no (for sure knowledge) but enough to take a chance.

I looked at what it was going to cost me for shipping and got ready to throw in my buy-in! I entered ($12.00 dollars as my max bid) and at the last 3 min. pulled the trigger. I got it for the price mentioned $10.49. I figure if it will produce enough CFM I can replace or rework the motor if the need be and still be all in for a lot cheaper than these. http://www.blacksmithsdepot.com/prod...e-blowers.html so time will tell if I did good or not!

Ken, you are the reason I went this way!:what!: After our conversation about my forge I re-built but have yet to fire needing a blower for it too run off of the PID like I want it too. Well that has been in the back of my mind every since. So I took another look at my set-up and I had kind of put provisions into the re-build to add a blower if I wanted or needed. So I began to start gathering parts. And maybe it cause I am cheap, maybe its because I like a challenge but decided to give it a go with this one.

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Although there are likely many of them being used as forge blowers, my advice is to stay away from shaded pole blowers. When I was still too tight to by one of the actual forge blowers, I used shaded pole blowers....and replaced about one every other month, until I finally decided to spend the money and buy "the real thing".

The issue with shade pole blowers is that they are NOT designed for ANY amount of back pressure, and in a forge application there is always back pressure. The more back pressure, the less CFM the blower puts out (and takes in), which causes cooling problems with the motor, eventually burning itself out. With LIGHT use (a couple of hours per week) you can make one last for "a while", but if you do like I was doing..... 8-10 hour per day, 5-6 days a week, the most you'll likely get is a month or so.

It all boils down to how much back pressure is present, and the duration of use. Where things get tricky with shaded pole blowers is the amount of back pressure you create....for example my forge is set up with the blower attached to a 12" X 2" pipe, into a 2" x 1 1/2" elbow, then into a 18" X 1 1/2" pipe.....that creates a lot of back pressure for a shade pole blower. I don't know the specific reduction numbers, but I do know that whatever the CFM rating for the blower is.....whatever back pressure exists, degrades that number coorespondingly.

Ed, advice acknowledged. However this one is already mine so gonna hook it up and if nothing else I will get some valuable knowledge!

It looks like the type That came on my Mankel Three Burner forge. It is many years old and still runs fine. There must be different qualities of these. I hope yours developes enough pressure and cools well.

Chris- You sounded happier with your purchase than our three year old pup with a new chew toy! Hope it works well for you- not a huge gamble at that price.

Guess ignorance is bliss, but at my level, I'm still thrilled to have the two burner venturi forge I built a couple years ago- and really enjoying using it.
But, I'm seeing the advantages of the forges you guys are discussing, and I'm always on the prowle for stuff to do my next project.

So-could someone please explain what a shaded pole blower is-
-and, if I want to convert mine to a forced draft at some time, could I use a Y manifold to use one blower for two ports? -or would I need two blowers?

Thanks,
Bill

Chris I don't know anything about the blower I don'thave one on my propane forge and my coal forge is hooked into my shop air.The one in the pic looks like it may have a military plug in and if so may be 24 volts.

Bill Hubbell said:

Chris- You sounded happier with your purchase than our three year old pup with a new chew toy! Hope it works well for you- not a huge gamble at that price.

Guess ignorance is bliss, but at my level, I'm still thrilled to have the two burner venturi forge I built a couple years ago- and really enjoying using it.
But, I'm seeing the advantages of the forges you guys are discussing, and I'm always on the prowle for stuff to do my next project.

So-could someone please explain what a shaded pole blower is-
-and, if I want to convert mine to a forced draft at some time, could I use a Y manifold to use one blower for two ports? -or would I need two blowers?

Thanks,
Bill

Click to expand...

Bill, the name is Cliff but hey don't call me late for supper and we ain't got a problem!:biggrin: Here is an explanation of the blower ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaded-pole_motor

I am going to a blower for a different reason than most and really don't want to get into that at the moment, because I have been told it won't work, especially without a blower. I do love a challenge. Tell me it can't be done and I will usually show you it can!!!:what!::biggrin::happy:

If I read the plate correctly it was VAC, (volts alternating current), my problem was I couldn't see it good enough to tell whether it was 110V - 220V. I have both in the shop my grinder has a 220 motor as well as I needed for my welder!

Sorry Chris- I Mean Cliff!
Thanks for the link. Just going by what Wiki said, it looks like the only negatives to a shaded pole is that they don't have much start-up torque, and they don't work well over about 1/4 horsepower. I wouldn't think the forge application would require much start-up torque, but, I'm sure there are other characteristics that I'm not aware of. Not only that, but the advice of a seasoned builder usually trumps wikipedia in my book.

I have a small blower off of a wood-burning add-on furnace that I scrapped. It was factory installed, and controlled by a room thermostat on the main house floor. When the thermostat called for heat, that forced draft fan would kick in to burn hotter. It had to cycle quite a bit and outlasted the furnace. I thought it might be usable on a forge if I ever went to a forced draft type. I think I'll look inside it to see if it's a shaded pole type, just out of curiosity.
Anyway, good luck with your project if you decide to give it a shot.
One more quick question- I'm just getting rolling with knife-making. I was wondering how your wife and loved ones reacted when they first discovered you had an incurable addiction to grinding belts? I just can't seem to get enough. -can barely make it to the next delivery!
Anyway,
Thanks again, CLIFF
Bill

A big disadvantage of shaded pole motors in dirty environments, particularly those with airborne metal dust, is that they are not sealed. The fact that electric motors work by interacting magnetic fields means that they will attract steel particles.

Shaded pole motors also tend to run hot, so reducing airflow to the motor is not really an option.

Blowing the motor clean every time you use it, and being careful where you grind, goes a long way towards keeping shaded pole motors running.

Like mentioned, the shaded pole motors have little to no Uuumph, although I have an electric wall clock that still runs from the 70s (?). These blowers are available with regular motors, which I have. 3 years and counting.




Rudy