Whats the Difference?

C

CattleMaster247

Active Member
Ok so I'm looking for a brief summary on the difference between: synthetic,diamond,glass, and water stones. I have a edge pro and have a large assortment of stones. Love the sharpener, but also want to start honing my skills in free hand. Any suggestions or opinions are appreciated
 
1) Water Stones are usually, "But not always" Natural stone that has been quarried for the abrasive quality in a Grit range.

2) Synthetic are just that! Man made materials that have a certain grit factor to them.

3) Diamond is a stone/ Material or butchers Steel that is coated/impregnated with diamond in a grit of some level, Usually 600 grit or finer.

4) Glass is, Well you guessed it! Glass, used to tape down a sandpaper on for sharpening or I have used the top of a Glass vehicle window to hone and straighten a sharp edge while camping or parked on the side of a road that has turned into a cutting fiesta for some reason?

Laurence

www.westsidesharpening.com/
 
The majority of stones you'll run across are of the synthetic variety unless they are labeled- Arkansas, India, or Water stones.

Water Stones- I've only used a couple water stones in my life but I wouldn't recommend these for a beginner to hand sharpening. Mostly because they're expensive and require maintainence and skills that the others don't. These certainly have their place I just dont see them as right for a beginner.

Natural Stones- I've used a bunch of different natural stones and have to admit that my opinion is very subjective as to just how the stone feels and cuts. While I may like one perticular stone I may dislike another just based on how I FEEL about it. I always seemed to like the harder varieties of naturals for the final finishing stone.

Synthetic Stones- Seem more consistant than naturals and tend to cut a bit more aggressivley with less wear to the stone. I'd personally go this route over naturals. If I wanted to get started on the right foot with I'd go with this 8" Norton set with two syntetics and a natural stone-
http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/N...serID=24853615&SessionID=iTUzbKbom8PzqQOhmUjN

Diamond Stones- Been wanting to try these forever and finally picked a couple up at the Bladeshow. These are pretty much no maintainence stones that should last forever. In comparison to the the other types they are VERY aggressive in comparable grits which is a good thing. Faster cut equals less time to produce a quality edge. I lucked into a crazy deal on Sunday at the Booth for Smith's Sharpeners and got a deal on two stones for $30 because the plastic cover had a crack :) ... score ! These are what I got-
http://smithsproducts.com/products/product.asp?id=19&cid=4
http://smithsproducts.com/products/product.asp?id=20&cid=4

Now that I've used these a bit I can HIGHLY recommend them. They'll produce a hair popping edge with minimal effort. One caveat that may be an issue to a beginner though is the holes in the stones surface which can catch the tip of the blade while sharpening. I've found that I can position my blade on the stone so I end up on the solid section when I get to the tip and this solves that problem easily. I can see where one may like the stones even more if they went with the DMT stones that are solid surface like these-
http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/DMT-8-Dia-Sharp-Diamond-Kit-P405C24.aspx

I'm impressed enough with the Smith's stones that I'll probably add a DMT 1200 grit and an 8000 grit like the ones above for the added ability to produce task specific edges but as it stands the 750 grit stone I've got produces an excellent edge.

If you want to get started with an inexpensive stone that'll give a shaving sharp edge I got one of these for my nephew to learn with and it's also a quality stone-
http://www.smkw.com/webapp/eCommerce/products/Norton®/Norton®+8"+Crysolon+Pike+Stone/NTJB8.html

Thats my take on stones.

-Josh
 
Hey Josh Thanks

Josh Dabney said:
The majority of stones you'll run across are of the synthetic variety unless they are labeled- Arkansas, India, or Water stones.

Water Stones- I've only used a couple water stones in my life but I wouldn't recommend these for a beginner to hand sharpening. Mostly because they're expensive and require maintainence and skills that the others don't. These certainly have their place I just dont see them as right for a beginner.

Natural Stones- I've used a bunch of different natural stones and have to admit that my opinion is very subjective as to just how the stone feels and cuts. While I may like one perticular stone I may dislike another just based on how I FEEL about it. I always seemed to like the harder varieties of naturals for the final finishing stone.

Synthetic Stones- Seem more consistant than naturals and tend to cut a bit more aggressivley with less wear to the stone. I'd personally go this route over naturals. If I wanted to get started on the right foot with I'd go with this 8" Norton set with two syntetics and a natural stone-
http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/N...serID=24853615&SessionID=iTUzbKbom8PzqQOhmUjN

Diamond Stones- Been wanting to try these forever and finally picked a couple up at the Bladeshow. These are pretty much no maintainence stones that should last forever. In comparison to the the other types they are VERY aggressive in comparable grits which is a good thing. Faster cut equals less time to produce a quality edge. I lucked into a crazy deal on Sunday at the Booth for Smith's Sharpeners and got a deal on two stones for $30 because the plastic cover had a crack :) ... score ! These are what I got-
http://smithsproducts.com/products/product.asp?id=19&cid=4
http://smithsproducts.com/products/product.asp?id=20&cid=4

Now that I've used these a bit I can HIGHLY recommend them. They'll produce a hair popping edge with minimal effort. One caveat that may be an issue to a beginner though is the holes in the stones surface which can catch the tip of the blade while sharpening. I've found that I can position my blade on the stone so I end up on the solid section when I get to the tip and this solves that problem easily. I can see where one may like the stones even more if they went with the DMT stones that are solid surface like these-
http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/DMT-8-Dia-Sharp-Diamond-Kit-P405C24.aspx

I'm impressed enough with the Smith's stones that I'll probably add a DMT 1200 grit and an 8000 grit like the ones above for the added ability to produce task specific edges but as it stands the 750 grit stone I've got produces an excellent edge.

If you want to get started with an inexpensive stone that'll give a shaving sharp edge I got one of these for my nephew to learn with and it's also a quality stone-
http://www.smkw.com/webapp/eCommerce/products/Norton®/Norton®+8"+Crysolon+Pike+Stone/NTJB8.html

Thats my take on stones.

-Josh
Click to expand...
Hey Josh as usual I am appreciative of the advice and the depth too them. I have a 140DMT for leveling my other stones, which are all primarily my edge pro modified stones. I went ahead and purchased the DMT Duo Sharps in 4 different grits up to the 1200 grit mark. I used my 140 to fix a broken tip, performed amazingly. I went with the 8 inch series as well. I will post with details my thoughts and opinions on them. When you mentioned the lack of maintenance required with the diamond stones, you had me pegged. Again thank you for the advice, and the time you took to write it. A follow up question is what process do you prefer for sharpening stainless.
 
Cattlemaster247,

Sharpening stainless is the same as sharpening carbon steels. The mechanics of whats happening on the edge of the blade doesn't change a bit.

In KISS terms, Sharpen to a burr then remove burr and its sharp.

How sharp is a product of what grit you go to while sharpening.

What grit you should go to is up to what you prefer and should be a choice made by sharpening and using to see what you like with the purpose of the blade also determining just what type of edge you go with. A straight razor or a scalpel has different needs than a chopper or a chefs knife.

In general- What grit I start with depends on the condition of the edge to begin with. Is the edge chipped up or have other damage ? Is it just excessively thick and need to be thinned down. Is it in fine shape other than being dull ?

Start with the first grit and sharpen until there's a burr along the entire edge then go to the next grit.

I personally use a 5-4-3-2-1 after I've established the initial burr. That means 5 strokes on the right side followed by 5 on the left. Then 4 on the right then 4 on the left etc. After that I'll inspect my edge and either do another 5-4-3-2-1 or go to the next finer stone and do the same thing.

Once I'm done on the stones I'll strop on leather with some white rouge to remove the burr.

At this point I'll slice some paper and see how it shaves and decide if I'm done or not. I find occasionally after stropping I may need a couple light strokes on the finest stone to get the blazing sharpness I'm after. This could be do to me rolling the edge ever so slightly on the strop or due the qualities of the blade itself but reguardless sometimes I feel these finishing strokes on the stone needed and other times not.

Like most things with knives and knifemaking sharpening is very subjective to the person doing it and if you ask 10 makers you'll get 10 different answers. This is just how I go about it but certainly not the only way. ALOT of folks will buff the burr off as opposed to stropping and although I've tried that technique many times I've never found love for it and prefer to do it by hand with a strop.

Only 3 thing are required to be good at hand sharpening. Practice Practice Practice ;)

Take care-

Josh
 
My personal favorite is a Fine India stone (which is actually a synthetic stone) made my Norton Abrasives. This is gona sound "out there" but when I have people ask me to teach them how to sharpen a knife by hand, my response it to tell them to get a "good" stone (whatever varitey/type they choose), then go to a "junk" store and purchase 3-4 old paring knives.....by the time those paring knives are down to the size of toothpicks.....they'll have learned how to sharpen a knife.
The reason I word it that way is because free hand sharpening, is just like free hand grinding...it takes time and practice, and most importantly, you must develop a "feel" that can only be achieved by repetition.
 
EdCaffreyMS said:
My personal favorite is a Fine India stone (which is actually a synthetic stone) made my Norton Abrasives. This is gona sound "out there" but when I have people ask me to teach them how to sharpen a knife by hand, my response it to tell them to get a "good" stone (whatever varitey/type they choose), then go to a "junk" store and purchase 3-4 old paring knives.....by the time those paring knives are down to the size of toothpicks.....they'll have learned how to sharpen a knife.
The reason I word it that way is because free hand sharpening, is just like free hand grinding...it takes time and practice, and most importantly, you must develop a "feel" that can only be achieved by repetition.
Click to expand...


I personally sharpen up to a 100 knives a day along with run a store and make knives.
I use my 2 x 72" variable speed belt grinder with belts in the range of 120 Grit to 2000 Grit.

That way the stone moves and I hand hold the blade at the appropriate angle.

I agree with Ed here 100% that you have to develop your own feel for whats happening.

That happens through repetition.

So keep your nose to the grind stone!

Laurence

www.rhinoknives.com
 
I sharpen by hand. Have several great naturals but must admit I'm switching back to synthetics. Actually this seems to be the case for quite a few of my fellow sharpeners.

Naturals:
Pros - great finishers, unique, nice feel
Cons - to many fakes around, expensive, no specific grit

Synthetics:
Pros - cheap, grit scales (consistency), cut fast, always available if I need a replacement
Cons - can't really think of any. Well maybe some can be to cheap = lack of quality

This is of course my opinion, others might think differently!
 
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Cattlemaster I agree with Ed and Josh , but there is no simple summary it costs about 500 to 1k worth of stones to get it covered right. you can get the nortons in 500/1000 2k/4k 6k and 8k then get a chinese 12/14k whet stone and follow it up with some diamond spray on a strop up to 20k and have everything to sharpen by hand. I have a tormek t7 profesional sharpening machine 25 stones 5 strops pasted and not and paper wheel system and various 2x72 leather belts and high grit structured abrasive belts up to 4k and use most of what I mention depending on the knife im sharpening. The learning curve is not short. Kellyw
 
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