Help Needed.

pugsrok

Well-Known Member
I have been making knives out of files, the grind in way. now since i have no way to heat treat the knife is always too soft. Also the edge is wavy. Are there ways to stop that from happening? Also should i get a different type of steel like 01 toolsteel, or 440 stainless? And should i stop using my benchgrinder, and save up for something made just for knifemaking?
Also What should i use forheat treating?

Thank you for any help

Pugs.
 
Getting a flat with a circle is very hard too do.
I would anneal the files first so they're soft enough to shape with another file.
Craftsman sells a 2 x 42 belt grinder for around 130.00$ not the greatest for hogging but will def work for stock removal from files.
Foremost you need to start reading everything you can about steel and how it works,not as simple as shaping and it's done.
After googling for a few days your questions will have more direction.
 
Get 01 steel ! its cheap and makes a great knife. And save up for at least a kmg or grizzly grinder. Way worth it. And then upgrade later on. As for heat treating, you can get by with a torch but a real oven such as paragon or even heat rules! Or find someone to do it for you. I regularly treat knives for people. if ya need to email me. omachearleycustomknives@yahoo.com . Hope I was of some help. GOD BLESS!!
 
No, a belt grinder is set up to work with metal. The better ones will have a slower speed than a sander. They should also allow access to drive wheel for grinding, the width of the platten should be very close the the belt, and it should be set up to allow slack belt grinding in some manner. The belts can be the same grints and made from the same abrasive, though there are abrasives that are intended for use with metal only.

If you alread have a bench mounted belt sander and you want to get grinding belts for it until you can afford a purpose built grinder, then go for it. If you lay out $100-$150 for one then that's good money that could have been set aside in an account towards the purchase of a good unit. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt to prove it but the sander is gone.

You might want to take a look at the Coote grinder. It's in between the Grizzley and the KMG in quality. I have one and it hasn't let me down yet but I forge and a stock removal person might want a little more flexability in their machine.

Doug Lester
 
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pugs,

It's extremely difficult to grind a blade on a bench grinder....it's tough enough to do a decent job with a belt grinder! If your turning the steel any colors at all when you grind, your softening the steel from it's "as a file state".

A belt grinder and a belt sander are essentially the same things....the terms are just a matter if individual preference. The difference is that machines designed for knifemaking are super heavy duty compared to belt sanders made for woodworking. Most knifemaking grinders use either a 2"x48" or a 2"x72" belt. The belts are available in everything from 36 grit, to super fine 15 micron grits. There is a major difference between abrasives meant to work wood, and those meant to work metal.

It sounds to me like your ready to "step up" in your knifemaking...in my opinion, NOTHING will increase the overall quality of your blades than a good knifemaker grinder.
My personal favorite is the KMG, but there are a number of various options available for a good belt grinder.
 
so a bench mounted belt grinder. And for heat treating, how much is it on average to send it somewhere to get it treated? and where can i get just enough 01 steel for one knife just to try that?
 
If you are working on wood it is a sander.
If you are working on metal it is a grinder.
Get Tracy's NWG plans, study them, check out his web-site, www.usaknifemaker.com and start saving up for parts.
If you do a good job on the construction you have a grinder/sander as good as you can buy manufactured.
 
If you want to temper them back so they're not so brittle but will still hold an edge, files can make good knives. You won't really know till it's done and you test it.

If you're going to the trouble of fully annealing, grind, then re-heat-treating them, you're better off buying known steel. It's pretty cheap and you'll have a better chance of getting it right the first time. Even files of the same brand might be different alloys, depending who you ask.

I wouldn't use a bench-grinder for anything but the roughest profiling. It's way too easy to overheat the steel if it's hardened, and way too difficult to grind good bevels regardless. As limited as it is, a 2x42 is a much better tool for this stuff and you can find them for $100 or less if you shop around.

Just a few two-centses ;)
 
Getting just a piece of steel to make one blade is the expensive way to go but Tracy at USA Knife Makers can probably set you up and Jantz lists it in their catalog. You can access Jantz at www.knifemaking.com. Take a look at what some of the steel suppliers sells it for. It might not cost you a lot more to get a 60" piece from Admiral Steel. It costs to have a knife making supplier buy the steel and cut it to length for you.

Doug Lester
 
Stay away from 01 until you get an oven. A torch will not get 01 HTed anywhere near right. Get some 10/70/80/84. These you can get by using a torch and canola oil. If you must use 01, send it out for HT.
 
Well I see you found KD PR!! Glad you came over here. There are many Makers that can help you much better than I can!! But I think it is Great that a Teen like you is interested in making knives. At least we know we have another Generation of Makers coming along!!2thumbs Keep at it and by the time you are our age, you will be a master Maker!!
 
Do a google search for the size belt you need. Such as 4x36 or whatever. I ground a few blade-shaped objects on a grinder like that. It isn't the best choice but it can be done.

EDIT: if you have the grinder I'm thinking of, you should be able to get belts at the same store you bought it. They will likely be a pretty basic AO (aluminum oxide) available in grits from 50-120. Not the greatest, but they will remove steel. Try to get a good file or two and several sheets of sandpaper also; you'll want to clean up all the coarse grinding marks and even out plunges and stuff before you HT.

Once you grind a blade or two on that 4", trust me, you'll either give up completely or find a way to get at least a slightly better grinder. That 4" is pretty difficult to work with. Especially when it comes to little things like cutting plunges straight and getting flats, flat. :D

Don't forget to browse around the forum as much as you can! You're on the right track and will find a lot of your questions (now and in the future) have already been answered in existing threads. It's better than staring at the TV in any case ;)
 
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Well it's not the one I thought then, lol. Regardless, my point is, it CAN be done with tools and supplies you can find at the local hardware store. NOT THE STEEL, though! Get your steel from a maker or reputable dealer, the mild welding steel at the hardware store is good for building shelves and whatnot but won't harden properly for a blade. Get you a piece of 1080 or 1084 as others requested.
 
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